Sinfest

[Puma]

Oh, I agree with that. Even Darq acknowledged that very early in this thread. I would add that in no way is this a uniquely American condition.

It's just that I turned on my computer this morning, and saw that Kim Kardashian story, and thought, Okay I can see where Darq is coming from, even if I don't agree with where he went with it.

[Thy Brilliance]

[Darqcyde]

[Major Tom]

[Dogen]

[Darqcyde]

Tom: I'm still trying to figure out where the goal post are.

Also, destroying culturally relevant artifacts goes a long way towards making something irrelevant, especially if the traditions associated with their fabrication are not well documented. Culture has to be 'something', whether a physical (artifacts) or intangible (ideas, beliefs) enduring thing or a transient act (traditions, which includes performances). I'm not saying there can't be progress but I think that tradition is an inherent property of anything that is culturally significant; if no tradition develops then that aspect of culture will be lost and forgotten. We too readily sacrifice tradition for progress.

I feel that American traditions and artifacts should be more advanced than where they are currently but we've held ourselves back by essentially whoring out our past at the cost of our own cultural identity. I think it's a lot weaker and more immature than it should be.
_________________
...if a single leaf holds the eye, it will be as if the remaining leaves were not there.
http://12ozlb.blogspot.com Now in book form: http://amzn.to/14E6OFy

[Dogen]

How the fuck do you define what a culture "should" be? Man, we ought to all be discussing Proust, at a 75th grade level, in our virtual classrooms while our fleshy bodies are serviced by Jessica Alba clones. That's what culture ought to be. That's a ridiculous sentiment you need to get over. You have the culture you have, and there is no culture that you "should" have, that you "deserve" to have, or that you "might have had had things gone differently." There is now, and only now, and this is what you get.

EDIT: Which, by the way, is totally irrelevant to whether or not we even have culture (we obviously do, I think that's been settled), or if it's dying (culture doesn't die, it just changes - you may not like it, but them's the breaks).
_________________
"Worse comes to worst, my people come first, but my tribe lives on every country on earth. I’ll do anything to protect them from hurt, the human race is what I serve." - Baba Brinkman

[Major Tom]

i think you're largely conflating the artifacts (tangible or otherwise) and their effects.

i could be mistaken, but you seem to be struggling with separating out two questions: (1) is there evidence of a "U.S. experience"? and (2) why isn't all that evidence sitting around where i can see it?

there have been many anecdotal responses to the first question and there are undoubtedly literally thousands more that could be offered, and objected to on the minutiae, but all the dots either start to form a picture or they don't.

as to the second, it sure as heck could be that an indelible aspect of US culture is a refusal to allow "tradition" to reign in progress. that doesn't mean that culture is somehow lost, but perhaps that evolution and revolution play more of a part in this culture and stasis and reverence play less.

[Darqcyde]

Dogen: Let me try to explain my view of use Tom's metaphor of dot's forming a picture. I'm not saying how much of a picture there should be, I'm saying that there are a lot of dots missing that shouldn't be missing.

Tom: Yeah I've come to realize that you've pretty much nailed it with part 2. The thing that bothers me is, not quite sure how to put this, there seems to be this wide spread notion that things are not this way. It's like we're trying to fool our selves into believing quite the opposite.
_________________
...if a single leaf holds the eye, it will be as if the remaining leaves were not there.
http://12ozlb.blogspot.com Now in book form: http://amzn.to/14E6OFy

[Major Tom]

on your first point: it's like dogen said: you got dots; just 'cuz they don't make a duckie like you wanted, that doesn't mean you don't got dots.


as to your second point, we're back to you not making any fucking sense, again.

[WheelsOfConfusion]

[Darqcyde]

[ShadowCell]

...so...whether or not Thomas Edison and Walt Disney were douchebags influences whether or not they contributed to a unique American culture?

[WheelsOfConfusion]

[Major Tom]

not douchebags

american douchebags