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What's Wrong With The World?
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jsimpleton



Joined: 01 Sep 2006
Posts: 143
Location: maryland/dc area USA

PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2006 7:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kame wrote:
I had this as my sig for a while, but here is goes, the paradox of capital punishment.

"If you support capital punishment, and your government executes an innocent person, then you too are guilty of murder, and you too deserve to die."


that's not a paradox at all, you just gotta look deeper into what is being said to see that. at BEST, and i do emphasize BEST, its accessory to murder (unless of course you're the dude that threw the switch).
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dazedb42



Joined: 09 Jul 2006
Posts: 2348
Location: Margaret River, Australia

PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2006 8:57 am    Post subject: Re: murphy's Reply with quote

Marik wrote:
dazedb42 wrote:
Monkey Mcdermott wrote:
Capital punishment doesnt work because it isnt televised in all its gruesome horror to the masses.


Is that why democracy doesn't work?


It's certainly why the sausage industry does work.


My Ex BIL was a butcher. Totally with you on that one.
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kame



Joined: 11 Jul 2006
Posts: 2565
Location: Alba Nuadh

PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2006 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Feiticeira wrote:
kame wrote:
Jen, do you really, really want to debate this? Because I don't.


Really? Because it looks like you're so eager to debate it you jumped right into an anti-death penalty rant the moment somebody used the words 'capital punishment'.

It was quite hilarious.


Touchy subject, mea culpa.
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trustedfaith



Joined: 09 Jul 2006
Posts: 3366
Location: My own little world...

PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2006 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since we were talking about mental issues equating or not equating to insanity...

Quote:
Experts: Attacks surpass comprehension

By JEFF DONN, Associated Press Writer
Mon Sep 25, 4:52 PM ET


It's a crime so monstrous as to surpass comprehension. Yet its passion takes root in some of the most tender ground of human experience: pregnancy and motherhood.

What drives a handful of women to slice open the bellies of others to steal their newborns? Researchers have uncovered hints.

"You can describe it as sort of the maternal instinct run amok," says psychiatrist Dr. Phillip Resnick, who had written about this kind of crime.

In East St. Louis, Ill., an innocent plea was entered Monday for Tiffany Hall, a 24-year-old woman charged with killing a woman and her fetus; investigators believe she cut the mother open with a pair of scissors. Authorities say Hall also told police she drowned the woman's three other children.

Such crimes are exceedingly rare in a country with more than 4 million births a year. Previously, only eight similar cases have been documented since 1987 by the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children. Yet they are frequent enough to have acquired a clinical-sounding name: newborn kidnapping by Caesarean section.

It is a variety of the more common crime of simply snatching an infant, experts say. Attackers are women of childbearing age who typically have lost a baby or can't have one, mental health professionals say. They feel empty and fiercely long for a child or another child to cement a shaky love relationship.

"They look at these pregnant woman and say, `Look at all the attention they're getting. They're complete,'" says N.G. Berrill, a New York-based legal psychologist. The attackers often fake their own pregnancy, take part in baby showers, and prepare nurseries at home.

However, at some moment they cross a boundary and descend almost to Shakespearean depths of tragedy. "The meaning of being barren for some women is just extraordinary," says Resnick.

Fashioning elaborate cons, they may trick a stranger into letting down her guard, or they may set upon a close friend without warning. The raw violence may vent a gusher of rage or jealousy directed at the pregnant victim.

In 2004, a Kansas woman allegedly drove to Missouri, strangled a pregnant woman with a rope, then cut out her baby with a kitchen knife. She awaits trial.

In 1987, in New Mexico, a married woman kidnapped a pregnant woman leaving a prenatal clinic, forced her into a car with a fake gun, strangled her, and delivered the baby with a set of car keys. She was sent to prison for at least 30 years when found guilty but mentally ill.

The assaulted women nearly always die, sometimes bleeding to death. The attackers then claim the newborns as their own, even if only as stillborns to be buried. However, the newborns often live and eventually return to surviving family when the crime is solved. At least two attackers later killed themselves.

Experts believe that the macabre surgery is strangely meant to fulfill a fantasy of really giving birth to the child. Sometimes it takes on the trappings of full-blown psychosis a delusion of being the birth mother.

More often, though, the crime grows out of a less profound disturbance, known as a personality disorder, experts say. While still in the realm of mental illness, such impulses may fail to meet the legal standard of insanity a failure to grasp right and wrong. The attackers often hide the mother's body afterward, seemingly aware they have done wrong.

Cathy Nahirny, who tracks such cases for the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children, still can't fathom them after 16 years there. She favors a simpler explanation.

"Are they evil? Yeah, I guess you could call them evil: They want what they want and they will stop at nothing," she says.

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Azmoten



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 2211
Location: St. Louis

PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2006 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Are they evil? Yeah, I guess you could call them evil"

What the fuck? I see no interpretation in which they are not evil.
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Desire



Joined: 09 Jul 2006
Posts: 587
Location: AK

PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2006 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really should have just stayed out of this thread.


Bad enough I've been thinking about the whole Sharon tate murder my whole pregnancy. Then that recent throat-slashing and kidnapping story. And now this. Sad


I will refrain from commenting on punishment and such here because between hormones, anger, and horror, nothing I could say right now would be rational.
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Darqcyde



Joined: 11 Jul 2006
Posts: 10660
Location: A false vacuum abiding in ignorance.

PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2006 10:41 pm    Post subject: Re: murphy's Reply with quote

dazedb42 wrote:
Marik wrote:
dazedb42 wrote:
Monkey Mcdermott wrote:
Capital punishment doesnt work because it isnt televised in all its gruesome horror to the masses.


Is that why democracy doesn't work?


It's certainly why the sausage industry does work.


My Ex BIL was a butcher. Totally with you on that one.


From what i was told by someone who worked in the Hebrew National plant 100% of the color in hotdogs comes from dye, other wise they'd be greyish-brown. Not that it would stop me from eating them.
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AfyonBlade



Joined: 16 Sep 2006
Posts: 681
Location: The Middle of Everywhere

PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think it would ever be possible to place this woman back into society. How could you ever trust someone with such an obvious lack for the valuue of human life?
She should be jailed for the rest of her natural life, but isolation isn't the answer. Have you ever gone even a week without talking to anyone? It's terrible, and anyone with such an obviously distorted psyche is definitely not going to get any better with that. Even with treatment, the most she should ever contribute to society again is to weedeat our highways.

Fuck capital punishment. I want weedeated highways without paying a Union'ed DoT guy to do it.
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