welcome to the fest
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

8/8 traumatized
Goto page Previous  1, 2
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Sinfest Forum Index -> Sinfest
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Ookamo



Joined: 16 Apr 2012
Posts: 193

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love that her tail indicates her emotional state.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Wheel



Joined: 06 Apr 2012
Posts: 103

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
For Fuchsia, it's a struggle because she let evil become who she is. For Harlequin here, it's no such issue because she didn't. Any more questions?


I don't like Harlequin for her name, too Batman and Joker and Harley Quinn. Not a big fan of Fern either. I don't know, Sparky, Flossy, something with a little life and sparkle.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Lich Mong



Joined: 31 May 2012
Posts: 475

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Miss Magenta wrote:
Fuchsia is having difficulties with becoming truly good because to her - being evil was not only her job, but her identity.


I read your whole post and was quite articulate, but this is the part that jumped out at me. Mainly because Harlequin is also a demon.

I know you explained how that's part of her job, not her identity, but I'm just not comfortable with that explanation. Unless those horns and tail come off, she is as much a devil girl as Fuchsia. I am discomforted that the only real difference I seen in their base nature is that Harlequin seems to be totally oblivious.

It bothers me that all of the capable and intelligent girls in the story-line seem to have deep seeded stuggles with denying who they were and changing for the better, while she can just do it. (As of this comic, big-D's ire does not even seem to sick in that pretty little head of hers as a lasting penalty.)

Now, let me go on to explain that I don't think this is bad story telling. I don't think that having a character who is natural more included to be good at something while another character with simular background is trying harder and still failing is unrealistic, even in the fantasy context that they're both demons. It's just something that upsets me to see.

I like Fuchsia; I don't like this airhead. Thus, it bothers me one is falling down and deeply conflicted while the other is completely lackadaisical about the whole thing while succeeding.

And that emotional response from me -if anything- indicates GOOD storytelling.
_________________
A MtG Webcomic
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Yinello



Joined: 10 May 2012
Posts: 2840
Location: Behind you

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

merest wrote:
By far my least favourite character - a sort of devil Mary Sue. Still, I hope to be surprised eventually.


How the fuck is she a Mary Sue? She's nice and reads books. Oh noes, she's that all-perfect character everyone hates, except she's not. She smuggles in robots quite badly, and opens the wrong doors.
_________________
Help. Help, my eyes are stuck from rolling so hard. Help.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Lich Mong



Joined: 31 May 2012
Posts: 475

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yinello wrote:
How the fuck is she a Mary Sue?

While I would -certainly- not call her a full fledged Sue, nor even the Sue'est person in the comic, the fact she is actively disobeying THE DEVIL and suffering no real consequences(yet) is a little Sue'ish.

But, we still don't know what the Devil is going to do to her. I doubt it will be anything horrific -this is a famly comic after all- but I, for one, hope it's lasting.
_________________
A MtG Webcomic
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Dogen



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 10889
Location: Bellingham, WA

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We just need to drop Mary Sue from our collective lexicon, ffs. Dissecting every character to point out their good qualities or their storyline quirks and then grading them on degree of Sueishness is utterly, utterly pointless.
_________________
"Worse comes to worst, my people come first, but my tribe lives on every country on earth. Iíll do anything to protect them from hurt, the human race is what I serve." - Baba Brinkman
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Miss Magenta



Joined: 09 Jun 2011
Posts: 2049
Location: im probably asleep right now

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Being a demon, a succubus, a devil girl does not automatically equal evil - that's the whole POINT of Fuchsia's struggle. That's the whole point of all those casual devil girls who aren't evil in any way shape or form, and don't display any sort of malice. The point is that she's struggling with acknowledging that fact. She struggles because everyone around her has told her that she's evil, BECAUSE she is a devil girl. Because of the assertion and assumption that devil girls are AUTOMATICALLY evil, when we've been shown so clearly that it's not the case.

Pebbles also has little to no struggle with being good at all, as well. Although you could argue that she's more neutral than anything, but I'm honestly under the impression that she's (albeit chaotic) good. Neutral implies that she's not taking a side, but she's already shown that she's taken the side that she presumes is good.

Fuchsia actively disobeyed D-man, but she never actually suffered any reprimands from him, in fact he never seemed to CARE. Well, he cared when she crashed the car... and sent her to her bedroom reminiscent of a father... but that was it. So I doubt he'd care that much if she disobeys him, either. Especially since her disobedience is minor, doesn't really effect business at all, while Fuchsia's kind of obviously frickin did.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Lich Mong



Joined: 31 May 2012
Posts: 475

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dogen: I agree that "Sue'ishness" is not a accurate measure of something being good or bad. I was just comparing and contrasting the troupe.

Miss Magenta: I understand what you're saying. I guess I am just too entrenched in both the role of genetics on behavior, as well as playing too much DnD and being raised Catholic, to accept that being a demon does not naturally cause an inclination towards malevolent behavior. Not that I'm saying such base instinct can't be overcome, mind you. But, I see it in the same way one would expect your dog to act differently than your child. What a thing is -for me- plays a large role in how I would expect it to behave.
If you go for a more Tabula Rasa philosophy, or simply feel those horns and tail are superficial, then I respect and understand that; I just can't bring myself to agree with it.

I would go on to say I think Fuchsia did suffer for her betrayal, but -ironically- in the form of guilt.

Please, don't even get me started on Pebbles..... I was under the impression she was a "defect" devil girl, regardless.
_________________
A MtG Webcomic
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Miss Magenta



Joined: 09 Jun 2011
Posts: 2049
Location: im probably asleep right now

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 8:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it's frickin stupid, but alright. I have no objections with you believing it, and you can remain firm in it. All I'm saying is that in Sinfest's canon it's proven to be not the case and that perhaps when concerning Sinfest you probably should ignore the beliefs for like five seconds because you probably won't enjoy it as much as you possibly could otherwise.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Lich Mong



Joined: 31 May 2012
Posts: 475

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Miss Magenta wrote:
I think it's frickin stupid, but alright.
Well, that's fair. Since -while not the terms I would use- it also accurately expresses my opinion of your opinion.

Miss Magenta wrote:
I have no objections with you believing it, and you can remain firm in it. All I'm saying is that in Sinfest's canon it's proven to be not the case and that perhaps when concerning Sinfest you probably should ignore the beliefs for like five seconds because you probably won't enjoy it as much as you possibly could otherwise.
I would agree that you are correct within Sinfest's canon..... well, the canon is somewhat conflicted on the matter, but I woud say you're more right than wrong.

I will also say that the Tabula Rasa a part of the canon is a part I don't like, and feel it clashes with the context of some of the characters. However, I am sure you feel that I am even MORE 'frickin stupid' about that.
_________________
A MtG Webcomic
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Miss Magenta



Joined: 09 Jun 2011
Posts: 2049
Location: im probably asleep right now

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think that you're frickin stupid, just your views on the matter. But it's ok. I don't see anything wrong with viewing anything in ways that I deem frickin stupid.

I'll be totally real, I don't get the whole tabula rasa thing but, man, whatever floats your boat is totally okay with me. I'll look it up later.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Lich Mong



Joined: 31 May 2012
Posts: 475

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Miss Magenta wrote:
I don't think that you're frickin stupid, just your views on the matter. But it's ok. I don't see anything wrong with viewing anything in ways that I deem frickin stupid.
I understand that.
Miss Magenta wrote:
I'll be totally real, I don't get the whole tabula rasa thing but, man, whatever floats your boat is totally okay with me. I'll look it up later.
I was probably being overly cute. It just means "blank slate."

Anyway, I go more for the descriptive evolution ethics explanation. So, a demon girl should have a different genome than a human, and -as such- a different worldview and sense of right and wrong.

However, if I understand you correctly, you feel the "boomfing" does not really change the base nature of the "boomfee." That those horns are more just for decoration, not showing some underlying issue. I think that the older canon that shows DRASTIC shifts in worldview after one has been "whammy" conflicts with that idea. However, the more resent comics emphasizing a strong nurture competent to the characters' actions agrees with you.

Also, my general overall sense of the comic is that Tat would agree more with what you have been saying than he would with what I have been saying. In light of that, I will -proverbially- conceded the round to you.
_________________
A MtG Webcomic
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Wheel



Joined: 06 Apr 2012
Posts: 103

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lich Mong wrote:
Miss Magenta wrote:
Fuchsia is having difficulties with becoming truly good because to her - being evil was not only her job, but her identity.


I read your whole post and was quite articulate, but this is the part that jumped out at me. Mainly because Harlequin is also a demon.

I know you explained how that's part of her job, not her identity, but I'm just not comfortable with that explanation. Unless those horns and tail come off, she is as much a devil girl as Fuchsia. I am discomforted that the only real difference I seen in their base nature is that Harlequin seems to be totally oblivious.

It bothers me that all of the capable and intelligent girls in the story-line seem to have deep seeded stuggles with denying who they were and changing for the better, while she can just do it. (As of this comic, big-D's ire does not even seem to sick in that pretty little head of hers as a lasting penalty.)

Now, let me go on to explain that I don't think this is bad story telling. I don't think that having a character who is natural more included to be good at something while another character with simular background is trying harder and still failing is unrealistic, even in the fantasy context that they're both demons. It's just something that upsets me to see.

I like Fuchsia; I don't like this airhead. Thus, it bothers me one is falling down and deeply conflicted while the other is completely lackadaisical about the whole thing while succeeding.

And that emotional response from me -if anything- indicates GOOD storytelling.


I like Fuchsia too, but I like this one as well. Life isn't fair, some things come easier to people who don't, on the surface at least, seem to deserve what they get. That's just the way it is. I think that's in Leviticus somewhere.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Sinfest Forum Index -> Sinfest All times are GMT
Goto page Previous  1, 2
Page 2 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group