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2013-02-24: Fierce mode
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Dogen



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 10424
Location: Bellingham, WA

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ibian wrote:
No official numbers because America. Just look around and maybe think a bit about what a man is looking for when setting out to find a mother for his child.

Also check the fertility rates around the world.

So you turned how you feel into an assumption and then tried to play it off as a fact. Got it.

For the record, if I ever decide to have kids, I'll be looking for a feminist for a wife. Very Happy
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Zhuinden



Joined: 02 Jul 2012
Posts: 282

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote







Out of all the "gender programming" strips so far, this new one is the one I understand least. The issues that are brought up are not in direct correlation with many problems we have on the "western" side of the world.
I'm just not sure what it is trying to say. "Do not think you need to stand by a man because there was witch burning 500 years ago"?
While it is true that most of these actions made no sense whatsoever, I just don't understand how even the feminarchy benefits from uploading concepts about these. It's like, they just uploaded stuff about nonsense to make them angry, instead of something that's an actual counter to the concepts they were originally taught.

I just don't understand this comic, that's all.


Last edited by Zhuinden on Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:08 am; edited 2 times in total
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Leohan



Joined: 27 Mar 2007
Posts: 961

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Smooshie wrote:
Leohan wrote:

Kinda simple, actually. We do know that women, just like men, are free to choose their way of life. The idea behind this comic, though, just like the Minique one earlier, is that women are made to WANT specific choices.


Aaaah. I had an inkling that you were talking about something like this, but I wasn't sure. That makes sense.
Don't tell anyone, but I'm starting to like you, 'cause you're helpful and stuff Embarassed

Glad to be of help. ^^

Also I can't believe that just now I noticed that I shouldn't press enter twice after a quote.
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Smooshie



Joined: 24 Jan 2013
Posts: 141
Location: NYC

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What you said:
Ibian wrote:
No official numbers because America. Just look around and maybe think a bit about what a man is looking for when setting out to find a mother for his child.

Also check the fertility rates around the world.


What I read:
Quote:
No official numbers because I'm making extreme generalizations based on my worldview and/or exposure to said world. Just look around and think about what I'm looking for when setting out to find a mother for my child.

Also I believe that feminists are recorded in the CIA's factbooks differently from regular people, and so therefore they must have different fertility rates or oh my goodness man what on earth are you even talking about

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Last edited by Smooshie on Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:05 am; edited 1 time in total
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LadySunami



Joined: 04 May 2009
Posts: 187
Location: Elsewhere

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alpha Aim wrote:
LadySunami wrote:
The question is, how do we stop genital mutilation without having people jump down our throats for religious suppression? We get enough harassment for things that don't actually suppress religious practices, like allowing civil same sex marriages and teaching evolutionary biology in school.

Depends. Would you prefer slowly influencing your opponents to your view, or would you rather drag them kicking and screaming into change?

I'm thinking we should start with the subtle influence thing, then drag the remaining extremely stubborn ones (that will alway continue to exist... somehow) the rest of the way.

Seems to be working decently for the marriage debate. The only opponents remaining in most states are the cruel and the self centered. (I say "self centered" and not "brainwashed" because I think the problem is more their refusal to question and re-evaluate their beliefs. Admitting something you believed in so strongly could actually be wrong takes a great deal of humility. It's easier to sit on a pedestal and proclaim the rest of the world demons and fools.)
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StateOfBedlam



Joined: 07 Feb 2013
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ibian wrote:
How about male genital mutilation. Cause we actually do that.


Yes, that happens fairly regularly.

Ibian wrote:
Unlike all that other stuff.


But so does the "other stuff." Well, 'cept for witch burning and foot binding. I think.

Smooshie wrote:
Is female genital mutilation really that bad? I mean, we practice circumcision...

To be clear, I'm against both, but I get a little annoyed whenever female genital mutilation is mentioned, as if guys don't get their cocks carved up in our own culture or in other cultures...

I don't want to start some cut vs uncut debate. My point is this: we seem to be more okay with removing something we are born with when we are males, and yet are horrified by the idea of something similar happening to a woman. Still, men definitely have it better, no matter what. I mean, it is a choice, right?


I'm going to throw in my input and say 1.) yes, it really is that bad. 2.) Yes, approx. 117 boys die in the U.S. each year from circumcision (mostly from infection and blood loss), and there are lots more nonlethal circumcision mistakes on top of that. Even if it always went smoothly, the fact remains that the procedure is one of removing at least half of the erogenous tissue, tens of thousands of nerve endings. 3.) It's a choice? For the parents, you mean?

Leohan wrote:
Kinda simple, actually. We do know that women, just like men, are free to choose their way of life. The idea behind this comic, though, just like the Minique one earlier, is that women are made to WANT specific choices.


Soft of, but not quite. This thread is moving so fast. Three pages have passed, I don't have time to elaborate.

Zhuinden wrote:
Out of all the "gender programming" strips so far, this is the one I understand least.


I think the two you posted illustrate the concept better.


Last edited by StateOfBedlam on Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:55 am; edited 1 time in total
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lol



Joined: 16 Nov 2012
Posts: 136

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Edit: Crud. In the time it took me to type a response, the forum already addressed the hilarious "but what about the men?" posts.

Last edited by lol on Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:15 am; edited 2 times in total
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Dogen



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 10424
Location: Bellingham, WA

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Smooshie wrote:
Dogen wrote:

You also asked if female genital mutilation was "really that bad," which hopefully you realize now was kind of a stupid fucking question.

I guess I was unsuccessfully attempting to reframe it because genital mutilation is genital mutilation, whether it's a punishment or a rite of passage, regardless of anesthetization.

I apologize.

I'm with you to a point. Circumcision is an antiquated practice that serves no functional purpose, and creates obvious distress. But it's also orders of magnitude less severe than FGM, especially since circumcision is done to infants (who have the benefit of infant amnesia) while FGM is sometimes done on girls up into their teens. Also, the general severity of the wound is significantly less (especially in what's called Type 3 FGM, where they're sewn shut). So while "genital mutilation is genital mutilation," you could also say, "hitting is hitting," or, "a cut is a cut." Technically true, but it kind of denies the range of beatings available, or the difference between cutting your hand and being split from asshole to appetite. They are functionally, drastically different.
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Smooshie



Joined: 24 Jan 2013
Posts: 141
Location: NYC

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

StateOfBedlam wrote:

I'm going to throw in my input and say 1.) yes, it really is that bad. 2.) Yes, approx. 117 boys die in the U.S. each year from circumcision (mostly from infection and blood loss), and there are lots more nonlethal circumcision mistakes on top of that. Even if it always went smoothly, the fact remains that the procedure is one of removing at least half of the erogenous tissue, tens of thousands of nerve endings. 3.) It's a choice? For the parents, you mean?

lol wrote:

It takes only a quick google search to find out that, yes, female genital mutilation(FGM) can be "that bad." The typical male circumcision is a much, much different procedure than what people mean when they say "female genital mutilation."

The fact that you're comparing those two kinda undermines the rest of your post. Most people who disagree with FGM would also disagree with the male equivalent.

Fair enough. I've no doubt that it's really "that bad," and perhaps it was a bad idea to try and discuss male and female genital mutilation at the same time, but mutilation is mutilation to me.
And sure, it's a choice. It's also "totally different, man". I hear that defense from some pro-circumcision folks sometimes. I was being sarcastic.

Well... now I know not to compare the two when it comes to brutality. I'm learning! Very Happy
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LadySunami



Joined: 04 May 2009
Posts: 187
Location: Elsewhere

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Smooshie wrote:
What you said:
Ibian wrote:
No official numbers because America. Just look around and maybe think a bit about what a man is looking for when setting out to find a mother for his child.

Also check the fertility rates around the world.


What I read:
Quote:
No official numbers because I'm making extreme generalizations based on my worldview and/or exposure to said world. Just look around and think about what I'm looking for when setting out to find a mother for my child.

Also I believe that feminists are recorded in the CIA's factbooks differently from regular people, and so therefore they must have different fertility rates or oh my goodness man what on earth are you even talking about

To be fair, he could be right... But only because a feminist female who doesn't want children is probably more confident in that decision then a non-feminist might be. It's harder to guilt trip a feminist into settling down and having kids when she doesn't want them. (Please, tell me again why I'm obligated to pop out babies due to the fact I have functional female reproductive organs. I'd just love to hear more about it.)
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Smooshie



Joined: 24 Jan 2013
Posts: 141
Location: NYC

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LadySunami wrote:

To be fair, he could be right... But only because a feminist female who doesn't want children is probably more confident in that decision then a non-feminist might be. It's harder to guilt trip a feminist into settling down and having kids when she doesn't want them.

People are people. We all make dumb mistakes sometimes, and for some folks, those include falling blindly in love. I don't think feminists are immune to making bad life choices under those circumstances. Laughing
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Dogen



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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Location: Bellingham, WA

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LadySunami wrote:
To be fair, he could be right... But only because a feminist female who doesn't want children is probably more confident in that decision then a non-feminist might be. It's harder to guilt trip a feminist into settling down and having kids when she doesn't want them. (Please, tell me again why I'm obligated to pop out babies due to the fact I have functional female reproductive organs. I'd just love to hear more about it.)

Because if you don't offer your services as a babymaker to any man who wants them then you might end up... uhh... not having a man who views you as a human genetic oven?

I guess that might seem like a bad thing.

To a guy looking for a convenient genetic oven.
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Zhuinden



Joined: 02 Jul 2012
Posts: 282

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Who the hell looks specifically for a genetic oven?

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Confuzledish



Joined: 21 Jul 2012
Posts: 13

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To be fair about the 'witch burning' panel, both men and women were burned at the stake.
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Smooshie



Joined: 24 Jan 2013
Posts: 141
Location: NYC

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 9:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Confuzledish wrote:
To be fair about the 'witch burning' panel, both men and women were burned at the stake.

I think women got burned more often because society was more distrustful of them. A lot more restrictions on their behavior than men and all that jazz.
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