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2013-03-17: Witch
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ShadowCell



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
Posts: 6023
Location: California

PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

brought to you by the Cobra Commander School of Parenting
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AngelLilly



Joined: 03 Dec 2009
Posts: 327
Location: Somewhere Over The Rainbow

PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It might be interesting to note that some of those flashback strips show up when you type 'Lilith' into the search bar, just an observation.
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stripeypants



Joined: 24 Feb 2013
Posts: 3141
Location: Land of the Grumpuses

PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 6:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shadow Master wrote:
bitflipper wrote:
Shadow Master wrote:
Big D was teaching his son how to make sure the world can't hurt him or those he cares for by means of BOMF, and she ended up leaving him because of it.

Inasmuch as any reason has ever been revealed for her leaving D-man, it was due to his hunting angels and scaring Li'l E in the process. You even linked to that strip, yourself, earlier in this thread.


But what's wrong with exposing a child to such things?

There's no direct harm from it. The child isn't damaged or hurt in any way by such actions. It only causes the child to grow up stronger faster. Instead of being pampered, he's exposed to the importance of war against enemies from an early age. As a result, he won't grow up thinking the world is a place of rainbows and sunshine, where no one would ever DARE hurt him or his loved ones.

Throughout this arc, Big D was shown teaching Lil' E how to be strong and proactive in life, instead of being weak and always on the backfoot, which is a lethally dangerous level of ignorance and pacifism.

If anything, NOT teaching children how to be aggressive against their enemies is bad parenting, since it makes them grow up weaker.


Exposing kids to excess violence does cause damage. PTSD is a thing.

If your kids need to be trained as warriors, guess what is a stupid thing to do? Not teaching them how to discern what and whom actual threats are. Going after the wrong enemy leads to wasted energy, which you can't afford to do in a fight if you want to win.

It is useful to have a reputation as someone who can kick ass, but if you do it just for the sake of it, you appear vulnerable and lacking in judgement. Why vulnerable? Because you're a loose cannon who is liable to make huge mistakes. A more patient person who avoids wasting any energy will seek to settle conflict peacably and therefore reserve their forces for when they are needed. Such a person will also treat their underlings well, because no one needs underlings who betray you at the last minute, who sell you out, or who undermine your efforts via sabotage or negligence.

Aggressive =/= Successful At Fighting
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Raal



Joined: 16 Jun 2012
Posts: 53

PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zhuinden wrote:
What bugs me though, so she technically IS a witch, which sort of means the villagers were right in a sense. Now, the question is, "are we supposed to accept witches in our society", which honestly, I don't know.



Ok, if you don't have the answer to this in a blink, I'm going to present you:
"The burn-the-witch-guidelines"

Is she different?
yes- leave her alone
no- leave her alone
Are you afraid of her and feel the need to strike first?
yes- leave her alone, coward
no- good. Maybe try to get to know her better.
Is she dangerous if you put her or her beloved to danger?
yes- leave her alone
no- leave her alone
Are you sure she's hurting you or others?
yes- call the police
no- leave her alone

TL;DR: You don't burn the witch.
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MerchManDan



Joined: 20 Nov 2007
Posts: 1941
Location: Somewhere else.

PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hydra wrote:
Finally Sinfest is back in business!

Wow, is that a fact? Please remind us all: When exactly was Sinfest "out of" business? I promise, I'm really interested.
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almost a shame to waste dennis' talent on him.
except it's always a pleasure to see a good dennis insult.
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Ronald



Joined: 17 Sep 2007
Posts: 3055

PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FFKonoko wrote:
I might be wrong, but I didn't think the world was nearly so devil-filled or controlled back then.


We don't know that the world is devil-filled, only that Sinfest City, where The Devil lives, is devil-filled.
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Ronald



Joined: 17 Sep 2007
Posts: 3055

PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 12:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone get any impression on how long ago this strip was supposed to have taken place? There aren't any real timeframe indicators. It could just as easily have been a hundred years ago or more. That's probably intentional, of course.

Any consideration of "witches" has to be based on what "witch" is defined to mean in any given context. In some fiction, a witch is something one becomes; in others, it's simply what one is.

For example, the witches and warlocks in "Bewitched" are a specific type of magical being, like elves or nymphs or any number of other such beings who existed in the Bewitchedverse, entirely distinct from humans (or "mortals"). As are the witches and wizards of the Harry Potterverse (although they're apparently not, and don't consider themselves to be, non-humans). It's innate. It's how they're born. It's what they are.

That's not at all the same as an ordinary human/mortal (Willow from "Buffy the Vampire Slayer," for instance) becoming a witch or warlock by learning how to use the innate magical energy of the universe, much less by making a pact with Satan OSLT.

In the contemporary real world, of course, some people self-identify as witches because they practice a particular belief system. Other people label as "witches" anyone who doesn't practice their particular belief system. And so on.

So what's the deal supposed to be here? Who knows.
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stripeypants



Joined: 24 Feb 2013
Posts: 3141
Location: Land of the Grumpuses

PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Unless Li'l E is a hundred years old, it can't be that long.
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lol



Joined: 16 Nov 2012
Posts: 136

PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MerchManDan wrote:
Hydra wrote:
Finally Sinfest is back in business!

Wow, is that a fact? Please remind us all: When exactly was Sinfest "out of" business? I promise, I'm really interested.

I haven't checked through all the recent threads, but I was wondering when the inevitable "Finally. No more Sisterhood around telling us women are actually people" comments would surface.

Can't wait until Xanthe shows up in the background of a single panel and people talk about how Sinfest is ruined again.


Last edited by lol on Mon Mar 18, 2013 8:46 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Ronald



Joined: 17 Sep 2007
Posts: 3055

PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stripeypants wrote:
Unless Li'l E is a hundred years old, it can't be that long.


Well, that was sort of my point. For all we know, Li'l E is a hundred years old. Or maybe time travel was involved. Anything's possible in this strip.
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Ronald



Joined: 17 Sep 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On another note, interesting look for Torchbearer #2 there. When you tick off the Amish, well...
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mouse



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Miss Magenta wrote:
Zhuinden wrote:
What bugs me though, so she technically IS a witch, which sort of means the villagers were right in a sense.


Just because she can turn them to stone does not mean she's necessarily a witch.


well, back in old salem days, it was believed the witches had sex with the devil (after dancing around naked in the full moon light). so....if you are a single mom, and you have a kid with horns.....well, let's just say, there will probably be some gossip about your sex life.

but then one has to wonder why one would have sex with the devil, if not to acquire satanic powers. especially since she does seem to have magical powers, but has never been shown as satanic, or at all evil - so she apparently neither needs nor wants his powers. of course, the devil has always been known for his charm....
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mouse



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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gridcube wrote:
Lil'E ===> lily ===> lilith?

O_O


well, since 'lily' was pebbles' mangling of 'li'l e', taking it to 'lilith' seems a bit of a stretch.
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bitflipper



Joined: 09 Jul 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mouse wrote:
but then one has to wonder why one would have sex with the devil, if not to acquire satanic powers. especially since she does seem to have magical powers, but has never been shown as satanic, or at all evil - so she apparently neither needs nor wants his powers. of course, the devil has always been known for his charm....

But what if she is a Power in her own right? Lilith, after all, is often said to be the mother of the Lilitu--Mesopotamian demons--so it wouldn't be unreasonable to think of her as a goddess or demi-goddess. As such, would it really be all that surprising that she sees the Prince of Hell as an equal with whom she could have a meaningful relationship? It may well be that she's only looking for a peer, not for magical powers bought via a deal with the Devil.
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Phox



Joined: 11 Mar 2013
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 9:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do believe she is, Persephone given her colours are the colours of spring and her powers revolve around turning people "back to the earth" also her mean tempter when provoked enough. That and she has been repeatedly shown to be kind and gentle and a far more caring soul than if she was Lilith or any number of other fallen her concerns would be more... manipulative or else dark and twisted in off ways. Not to say that the devils that have been shown do not act in a human way, but most of those that have been shown are towards former allies or they are freshly turned or else have been humanized in some way. In any event, should be interesting to see what really tore them apart, likely the Devil's overreaction to what happened here and his full change from Guardian of The Underworld into Ruler of hell.

But should maybe leave the interpretation of the Artist's interpretation of the modifications of being roles and they way they have changed over time into the modern era... Least till we see The Devil and Persephone's wedding which i think we will see.
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