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The GOP and friends
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Darqcyde



Joined: 11 Jul 2006
Posts: 10559
Location: A false vacuum abiding in ignorance.

PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The real frustrating thing is that current American conservatives forget, won't admit, refuse to acknowledge, overlook the fact, or are simply ignorant that ALL of their cherished values were once considered liberal or outright revolutionary.

And lets not forget that many who are dubbed "liberals" are in fact Conservative Liberals
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bitflipper



Joined: 09 Jul 2011
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Location: Here and Now

PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 3:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kame wrote:
Perhaps you shouldn't describe yourself in oversimplified terms such as "conservative" or "liberal" and form a coherent three dimensional worldview that is elastic enough to adjust to a constantly evolving planet.

Nah, that goes against the tenets of being a curmudgeonly stick-in-the-mud. Razz

In seriousness, though, I have to admit that kame's got a point. I've said it before: I tend to dislike labeling myself. Perhaps that's just best as left at that.
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Felgraf



Joined: 10 Jul 2012
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darqcyde wrote:
Felgraf wrote:
/Also because willful ignorance makes me FURIOUS for some reason.

Few things are as frustrating as dealing with someone who's attitude is "I don't know, I don't care, I don't want to listen to you."

It's like dealing with a child that sticks their fingers in their ears, closes their eyes and starts going "NYAH NYAH NYAH!"


Indeed! Although I also sometimes wonder/worry if I'm really *that* different from them.

Long story short: Free Will, of *some* sort, is an axiom I build a lot of my worldview on. That I have, in some strange capacity, at least the ability to alter how I think about things over the long term, even if I can't immediately change my reactions. Whether this comes from some divine soul, or some really, reaaaallly weird feedback loop, I believe I have *some* degree of autonomy...

And if it was ever somehow 'proven' that free will was a myth, I'd... probably react like young earth creationists do about evolution. And I admit this is a thought that distresses me.

/I think about things waaaaaaayyy too much.
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Darqcyde



Joined: 11 Jul 2006
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Location: A false vacuum abiding in ignorance.

PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found this amusing, and he rambles a bit, but it's short and at the end Jon Waters makes a very good point: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6HDuqfhJtU
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Feiticeira



Joined: 09 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Felgraf wrote:
Long story short: Free Will, of *some* sort, is an axiom I build a lot of my worldview on. That I have, in some strange capacity, at least the ability to alter how I think about things over the long term, even if I can't immediately change my reactions. Whether this comes from some divine soul, or some really, reaaaallly weird feedback loop, I believe I have *some* degree of autonomy...

And if it was ever somehow 'proven' that free will was a myth, I'd... probably react like young earth creationists do about evolution. And I admit this is a thought that distresses me.

/I think about things waaaaaaayyy too much.


Sam Harris on free will.

You may find it distressing, I suppose, if you find his arguments compelling (I do, but the absence of free will does not distress me). So try not to go nuts.
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Sam



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PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 5:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The epistemological limits of what humans have to interpret the universe with means that the lack of the existence of free will is pretty much completely irrelevant to me
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Darqcyde



Joined: 11 Jul 2006
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Location: A false vacuum abiding in ignorance.

PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FUCK!!!!!!!!!! WHY THE FUCK DO THEY HAVE TO BE SO FUCKING PREDICTABLE!?!?!?!?!??!?

Quote:
Said King: "Some of the speculation that has come out is that yes, it was a foreign national and, speculating here, that it was potentially a person on a student visa. If that's the case, then we need to take a look at the big picture."
He added: "We need to be ever vigilant. We need to go far deeper into our border crossings... We need to take a look at the visa-waiver program and wonder what we're doing. If we can't background-check people that are coming from Saudi Arabia, how do we think we are going to background check the 11 to 20 million people that are here from who knows where?"

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mouse



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 9:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isn't there some saying about never missing an opportunity to make the most of a crisis? 's all king is doing. even if he has to start from completely groundless speculation and then make the crisis up out of the whole cloth.

i know it's wrong to hope this was done by some right-wing extremist, but i really hope this was done by a right-wing extremist.
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Finnegan



Joined: 01 May 2007
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Location: in that cool mountain air, on an appalachian trail

PostPosted: Wed Apr 17, 2013 10:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bitflipper wrote:
kame wrote:
Perhaps you shouldn't describe yourself in oversimplified terms such as "conservative" or "liberal" and form a coherent three dimensional worldview that is elastic enough to adjust to a constantly evolving planet.

Nah, that goes against the tenets of being a curmudgeonly stick-in-the-mud. Razz

In seriousness, though, I have to admit that kame's got a point. I've said it before: I tend to dislike labeling myself. Perhaps that's just best as left at that.


while I don't disagree I want to point out that some people find comfort in a firm definition of themselves and others, helps them to feel that they are part of an in-group, and frees our minds from having to spend the energy analyzing every aspect of everyone we meet before making a judgement call. while these might not be the ideal way of doing things, they can be helpful. also labels don't define people, people define labels. "conservative", "gay", "christian", "woman", etc. have different definitions for everyone, they aren't meant to be limiting but to aid in social interaction.
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Darqcyde



Joined: 11 Jul 2006
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Location: A false vacuum abiding in ignorance.

PostPosted: Sat Apr 20, 2013 2:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darqcyde wrote:
FUCK!!!!!!!!!! WHY THE FUCK DO THEY HAVE TO BE SO FUCKING PREDICTABLE!?!?!?!?!??!?

Quote:
Said King: "Some of the speculation that has come out is that yes, it was a foreign national and, speculating here, that it was potentially a person on a student visa. If that's the case, then we need to take a look at the big picture."
He added: "We need to be ever vigilant. We need to go far deeper into our border crossings... We need to take a look at the visa-waiver program and wonder what we're doing. If we can't background-check people that are coming from Saudi Arabia, how do we think we are going to background check the 11 to 20 million people that are here from who knows where?"

And now they're all hoping on board . . . http://news.yahoo.com/boston-bombings-shadow-immigration-bill-190931402--politics.html
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stripeypants



Joined: 24 Feb 2013
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Location: Land of the Grumpuses

PostPosted: Sat Apr 20, 2013 3:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sad Of course.
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WheelsOfConfusion



Joined: 09 Jul 2006
Posts: 12251
Location: Unknown Kaddath

PostPosted: Sat Apr 20, 2013 3:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

At least Lindsey Graham is (once again) not jumping on the train to Being A Total Shithead in the party. And he's backed up by McCain, who still hasn't totally sold out it seems.

I hope the story of this utter failure of humanity on the parts of these scumsucking politicians gets plastered all over the news for the weekend. They deserve a thorough and public shaming.
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ShadowCell



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
Posts: 6077
Location: California

PostPosted: Sat Apr 20, 2013 3:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

then you'll be really disappointed to hear that Lindsey Graham wants a military tribunal for the Boston bomber
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stripeypants



Joined: 24 Feb 2013
Posts: 3429
Location: Land of the Grumpuses

PostPosted: Sat Apr 20, 2013 3:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

At least he doesn't get to make important decisions or anyth-

Oh. Right. Sad
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WheelsOfConfusion



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PostPosted: Sat Apr 20, 2013 3:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ShadowCell wrote:
then you'll be really disappointed to hear that Lindsey Graham wants a military tribunal for the Boston bomber

Yeah, back down to status quo.
*edit* And McCain is backing him up on that. Ugh. Forget I said anything nice about them.
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