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stripeypants
Joined: 24 Feb 2013
Posts: 2786
Location: Land of the Grumpuses
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 Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 5:26 am Post subject: |
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And all my pants pockets are filled with meat and bananas.
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MerchManDan
Joined: 20 Nov 2007
Posts: 1840
Location: Somewhere else.
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 5:34 am Post subject: |
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...so you aren't just happy to see us?? 
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| mouse wrote: | almost a shame to waste dennis' talent on him.
except it's always a pleasure to see a good dennis insult. |
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ChastMastr
Joined: 15 Jul 2012
Posts: 418
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida, US
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 8:25 am Post subject: |
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| Rothide wrote: | | Is red clad women sexually appealing because red has been ingrained in our culture as fertility, or was the ingraining of red as fertility in culture caused because of our biological reaction to turn red when active in a sexual manner. |
Or are both of those derived from something else, metaphysical or otherwise? What does "redness" mean on other levels of reality? |
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penguins_fly
Joined: 09 Jun 2013
Posts: 7
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 11:54 am Post subject: |
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| diagram12345 wrote: | | Does any rational person truly believe that gender differences are completely socially constructed? |
Yes. In fact, I'd have to extend that to say that ALL rational people believe that gender differences are completely socially constructed... because gender is a social construct by definition. Sex is the word you want if talking about biology. Gender used to be only defined in the grammatical sense (genders for nouns in an given language) before the terminology was used explicitly to distinguish between biological characteristics and social roles. |
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Leohan
Joined: 27 Mar 2007
Posts: 961
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 12:33 pm Post subject: |
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| penguins_fly wrote: | | diagram12345 wrote: | | Does any rational person truly believe that gender differences are completely socially constructed? |
Yes. In fact, I'd have to extend that to say that ALL rational people believe that gender differences are completely socially constructed... because gender is a social construct by definition. Sex is the word you want if talking about biology. Gender used to be only defined in the grammatical sense (genders for nouns in an given language) before the terminology was used explicitly to distinguish between biological characteristics and social roles. |
Good first post and nickname. I approve
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Yinello
Joined: 10 May 2012
Posts: 2369
Location: Behind you
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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Considering people in red clothes sexy is definitely a social construct. Blood is red and yet that doesn't turn most of us on, because we know blood is connected to pain and wounds. There's also enough people who think others are sexier in blue, green, purple and other colors. I would've never considered someone in red sexier if I hadn't heard the idea from commercials, movies and songs.
Nothing biological about it.
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Leohan
Joined: 27 Mar 2007
Posts: 961
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 2:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Yinello wrote: | Considering people in red clothes sexy is definitely a social construct. Blood is red and yet that doesn't turn most of us on, because we know blood is connected to pain and wounds. There's also enough people who think others are sexier in blue, green, purple and other colors. I would've never considered someone in red sexier if I hadn't heard the idea from commercials, movies and songs.
Nothing biological about it. |
I heard that the color red means 'target' at a subconscious level. Makes people wary of the source of the color. Reason why you shouldn't pick red when playing Risk: The other players get more likely to target you specifically.
'Target' can take several meanings depending on context I guess.
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Sinfest Juggalo Worshipper
Last edited by Leohan on Sun Jun 16, 2013 3:04 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Yinello
Joined: 10 May 2012
Posts: 2369
Location: Behind you
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 2:59 pm Post subject: |
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I admit I've never played Risk with strangers, but I tend to target people like my boyfriend more than my sister. And he never picks red. But you could be right, things is, I feel it's really more something that everyone tells each other than something we have from birth.
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stripeypants
Joined: 24 Feb 2013
Posts: 2786
Location: Land of the Grumpuses
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 3:22 pm Post subject: |
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People ask me if I would identify as trans of there weren't social discrimination or we weren't so highly gendered (or some variant on that theme.). So I've had to sit and think a lot about this.
My first answer is that I don't live in that world, nor did I grow up in one, so I have no idea. A hypothetical like that is pretty useless when there are so many actual problems here in the real world.
My second answer is that I probably wouldn't be so concened and probably wouldn't have developed my identity as a trans person to thisdegree. Not because it isn't real, but because I woud have been able to goabout being me without any fuss. The fuss that is made means trans people have to think hard about questions many people don't ave to think about at all - and then people act as if we just up and decided thoughtlessly to beg for attention or put on a costume.
My third answer is that dysphoria doesn't appear to have to do with social pressure at all, because that's the thing you feel all by yourself even when no one is looking.
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tricksterson
Joined: 18 Aug 2012
Posts: 395
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 4:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Yinello wrote: | | Considering people in red clothes sexy is definitely a social construct. Blood is red and yet that doesn't turn most of us on, because we know blood is connected to pain and wounds. |
We clearly have had different friendsets. I will however agree that that springs from environment. I won't say "social construct" because that implies something planned whereas I think that society pretty much just grows in an at least semi-random way.
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Rune
Joined: 08 Oct 2011
Posts: 1023
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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| tricksterson wrote: | | Yinello wrote: | | Considering people in red clothes sexy is definitely a social construct. Blood is red and yet that doesn't turn most of us on, because we know blood is connected to pain and wounds. |
We clearly have had different friendsets. I will however agree that that springs from environment. I won't say "social construct" because that implies something planned whereas I think that society pretty much just grows in an at least semi-random way. |
Gum murals and gum walls aren't planned or deliberate in most cases, and just build up because of laziness, convenience, and because everyone else is doing it.
That doesn't make them any less constructed. |
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Samsally
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 6070
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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Okay are people really arguing that colors have a biological impact on people? Because I'ma need some serious data to believe that, considering not only that colors have hugely different meanings based on culture alone, but also you can't really prove to me that everybody sees color the same to start off with.
Keeping in mind that just because something isn't biologically hard-wired in doesn't mean it can't affect people on a subconscious level. Societal constructs affect people subconsciously ALL the time.
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ChastMastr
Joined: 15 Jul 2012
Posts: 418
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida, US
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 7:01 pm Post subject: |
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| penguins_fly wrote: | | In fact, I'd have to extend that to say that ALL rational people believe that gender differences are completely socially constructed... because gender is a social construct by definition. Sex is the word you want if talking about biology. Gender used to be only defined in the grammatical sense (genders for nouns in an given language) before the terminology was used explicitly to distinguish between biological characteristics and social roles. |
There's also gender in the metaphysical sense, though of course people's beliefs about that will vary. |
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stripeypants
Joined: 24 Feb 2013
Posts: 2786
Location: Land of the Grumpuses
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 7:04 pm Post subject: |
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| MerchManDan wrote: | | ...so you aren't just happy to see us?? |
Well I am happy to see you all. Which is why I brought enough bananas and meat to share!
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ChastMastr
Joined: 15 Jul 2012
Posts: 418
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida, US
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| Posted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 7:33 pm Post subject: |
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| diagram12345 wrote: | | As a fairly aggressive and *very* ambitious career woman, I don't subscribe to many stereotypes regarding gender differences and how women should act nor do I think that anyone should be pushed to act according to gender stereotypes. But it's fascinating to me that so many otherwise logical individuals seem inclined to ignore the inherent differences between the average man and average woman that influence their external behavior and actions. |
The one I disagree with most, regardless of the notions of biological sex, gender (grammatical), gender (metaphysical), or anything else is this bit:
"so many otherwise logical individuals seem inclined to ignore the"
You know, people can just disagree without "deliberately ignoring" things that others believe to be inherent. Maybe they don't perceive them as inherent. Maybe they're right; maybe they're wrong; maybe it's more complex than that and they're partly both; but they don't have to be intellectually dishonest. |
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