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Socrates was a Christian III
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Thy Brilliance



Joined: 09 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 21, 2013 3:31 pm    Post subject: meanwhile in russia, putin snickers Reply with quote

fritterdonut wrote:
I'm still trying to decide how to respond to this guy.


Back in the day, duels solved every conflict.

Challenge that ignorant man to a duel.

PROVE THAT MIGHT IS RIGHT.
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mouse



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PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 7:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fritterdonut wrote:
I'm still trying to decide how to respond to this guy.

well, you are handicapped by the fact that this guy _knows_ he's right, so he doesn't have to listen to you. The best hope might be to find examples that demonstrate that having rights doesn't free you from consequences. So your "free -speech right " might allow you to speculate about methods of hijacking a plane while you wait in the security screening, but they won't save you from being strip-searched by TSA. You could _try_ pointing out that the 2nd only stops Congress from limiting what you say, but people generally don't want to be bothered by tedious things like facts.
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Dogen



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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2014 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Word doesn't like "wellbeing," "well-being," or, "well being." I like to see what it suggests, especially when I know I'm right... and in this case it recommends changing "well-being" to "well being," and then "well being" back to "well-being." It never stops wanting to change it.
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WheelsOfConfusion



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PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the wake of the Nye-Ham debates I've been wading through much denser Creationist bullshit in comment threads than previously. It's suddenly popular on the internet again after years of decline following the case in Dover which pretty thoroughly demolished the Intelligent Design movement.

I don't think it's because the debate popularized Creationism, though. Really this seems more like a flare-up, people who have already succumbed to the anti-evolution arguments are inspired to start posting again whenever the debate gets coverage.
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Heretical Rants



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PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 6:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

high-profile science people should never engage in debate with creationists - it only serves to validate their status in the public eye
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WheelsOfConfusion



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PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 7:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Heretical Rants wrote:
high-profile science people should never engage in debate with creationists - it only serves to validate their status in the public eye

I'm not entirely convinced that this is true, though sadly the debate was set up to funnel some $24K into Creation Museum coffers from ticket prices alone.
I think there is value in a successful display of reasonable thought and conclusions versus what YECs do. You don't have to be trained in formal logic to recognize things like "that Ham guy is just assuming his conclusions from the start. Where's the smarts in that?" The more you can get a Creationist to make themselves look as ridiculous as they are, the easier it is for people to feel uneasy about associating themselves with that kind of buffoon.
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Heretical Rants



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PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 9:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's why it's important to mock creationists, sure, but I don't think live debate has that effect on the kind of people that still buy into this crap

and remember
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Last edited by Heretical Rants on Mon Feb 17, 2014 10:44 am; edited 1 time in total
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Thy Brilliance



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PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 9:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

WheelsOfConfusion wrote:
Heretical Rants wrote:
high-profile science people should never engage in debate with creationists - it only serves to validate their status in the public eye

I'm not entirely convinced that this is true, though sadly the debate was set up to funnel some $24K into Creation Museum coffers from ticket prices alone.
I think there is value in a successful display of reasonable thought and conclusions versus what YECs do. You don't have to be trained in formal logic to recognize things like "that Ham guy is just assuming his conclusions from the start. Where's the smarts in that?" The more you can get a Creationist to make themselves look as ridiculous as they are, the easier it is for people to feel uneasy about associating themselves with that kind of buffoon.


Creationism actually being sustained through debate, who'da thunk it.
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Heretical Rants



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PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

live debate is just a really terrible format for presenting information

the creationist doesn't care whether the arguments they present are valid or not, all they want is to be seen up on the stage
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WheelsOfConfusion



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PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Heretical Rants wrote:
live debate is just a really terrible format for presenting information

This is true, but sometimes the argument IS the information. And the information isn't "there's still some controversy," the information is "holy shit, this Bible-thumper has got nothing!"

Quote:
the creationist doesn't care whether the arguments they present are valid or not, all they want is to be seen up on the stage

All the time they're NOT on stage, they're pumping out bullshit in slick websites and print materials without even the barest hint of a rebuttal, with nobody there to point out how stupid their fallacies are, with nobody to show the reader what the science actually says versus the Straw Man version being presented by the Creationists.

I don't think any significant number of people who saw the debate without a preconceived notion thought that Ham did well and made a convincing case. Indeed, most people say Bill Nye trashed him. The surveys and polls I see are typically over 90% in favor of Nye, which is way out of step with the prevelance of Creationist beliefs among the general public.
It's a pretty good bet that almost nobody converted to YEC thinking afterwards, and that significant numbers of mainstream Christians got a chance to see just how stupid the extremist Creationists are. "That guy's making the rest of us look bad." This is exactly what I've seen happen in the same comment threads were a few old-hand Creationists use it as their excuse to moan again. Most of the self-identified Christians in those threads are distancing themselves from the crazies.

My complaints after the fact are mostly restricted to how much Nye and/or his agent dropped the ball when it came to venue and format. They could have set this up in a way that didn't promote the Creation Museum at all. There was no reason they had to concede any of that stuff.
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stripeypants



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PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah. He's Bill Nye, after all. If Ham wanted a debate, no reason to do it on Ham's terms or to. help raise money for an anti-science museum.
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Dogen



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PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Conversation via text.

Friend: I'm can't stop thinking about this girl I dated in high school who I reconnected with on facebook, I think I still love her.
Me: How long have you guys been talking?
Friend: Like a week. I'm making some plans to move out to CA to be with her.
Me: That seems premature. You might want to think about slowing down and figuring out how she feels. She might like you but not have feelings as strong as yours, and moving too fast will just scare her off. Being obsessed with someone isn't healthy.
Friend: I just told her I'm still in love with her and want to be with her forever (C&P'd a text he sent her). I want to fly me and my daughter out to meet her.
Me: Well, she'll either say it back or never talk to you again. Good luck!
Friend: You give shitty advice.
Me: I hear that a lot from people who make bad decisions.

I'm the best. Therapist. Ever.
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stripeypants



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PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 4:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did they actually decide to go move out there?
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Dogen



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PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 4:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, this was all in the space of like ten minutes. He's just making plans - putting aside his tax return for airfare, figuring out what jobs to apply for, etc.


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mouse



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PostPosted: Thu Feb 27, 2014 12:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

oh dear - i thought he was maybe just out of college, but if he has a kid...that seems like a lot of sudden up-rooting for a week of talking on facebook.

but why am i seeing a sitcom based on your therapy sessions somewhere in the future?
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