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July 13: The Ol' Switcheroo
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OklahomanSun



Joined: 16 Mar 2014
Posts: 362

PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EverythingsJake wrote:
Now there's a turn of events I wasn't expecting. I rather thought there'd be a liberation of dozens or hundreds of fembots. Instead, three dormant (incipient?) bots are discarded like empty shells. One might derived some sense of Weapon F's current ideas about AI life and the value thereof. Or... lack of value.

I still want to know what happened to the rest of the dozen that we first saw back at headquarters. Five left the tubes and were attacked by drones, two are "dead," whatever that means in the Sinfest world, three are now escaping.


Blue murdered them. It's pretty clear that everyone who didn't make it out is dead.
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Ronald



Joined: 17 Sep 2007
Posts: 3252

PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yinello wrote:
EverythingsJake wrote:
Now there's a turn of events I wasn't expecting. I rather thought there'd be a liberation of dozens or hundreds of fembots. Instead, three dormant (incipient?) bots are discarded like empty shells. One might derived some sense of Weapon F's current ideas about AI life and the value thereof. Or... lack of value.


I guess in their mind the other fembots are worth sacrificing if they arenīt out of the system.

Itīs harsh but in a way I like it that they donīt have this savior morals instilled, instead itīs pure survival.


Well, to be fair, we don't know that they're "dead." They're just lying unconscious on the ground, whereas before they were standing unconscious inside boxes. Certainly it's not nice to just toss unconscious people around like ragdolls, but since it meant the difference between capture and escape to the Chalk-Bots, I personally would cut them a bit of slack. It was, for all intent and purpose, an act of self-defense, and so far as we know, it didn't actually injure the Fembot Classics.

Or maybe the Fembot Classics were "dead" all along. Maybe Fembots only become "alive" once their owners activate them.

The irony of the overall situation is that if Fembots weren't expressly created to be subordinate sex toys, they wouldn't exist at all. For Fembots to oppose the manufacture of Fembots is for them to condemn the process that brought them into existence, which is all that makes it possible oppose the manufacture of Fembots in the first place.

"You created me! And for that you must...uh...wait a minute..."

On some level, that constitutes fighting to achieve the eventual extinction of one's own "people." I'm presuming that Fembots don't literally last forever, so if, after all existing Fembots "die," no more are created, the (for lack of a better term) Fembot race will be no more.
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Jabberjay



Joined: 31 Jul 2012
Posts: 259

PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 9:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For more insight on creator/creation dynamic, watch this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyyrwoCec1k&index=14&list=PL8dPuuaLjXtOeEc9ME62zTfqc0h6Pe8vb

Important note: both Frankenstein's monster and fembots are an attempt to replace a function of women, although the function is different in each case.
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EverythingsJake



Joined: 26 Jun 2014
Posts: 298
Location: The Jazz Age

PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 4:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OklahomanSun wrote:

Blue murdered them. It's pretty clear that everyone who didn't make it out is dead.


No, all we know for certain is that five Weapon Fs were released from their tubes (five empty tubes were shown). Those five stood framed in a doorway. Those five were attacked. Of those five, two were "killed" (whatever that means in the Sinfest-verse), three have escaped.

But earlier, when Tange and Li'l E found the Weapon F room, there were twelve shown suspended in their tubes. Doing the simple math, that leaves seven unaccounted for -- either still in their tubes, or wandering elsewhere.
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stripeypants



Joined: 24 Feb 2013
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 6:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There were orders from D to destroy PX, but we haven't seen any orders to destroy all fembots that try to break free. I'm sure Blue would totally destroy them if that was the usual protocol, but that hasn't been shown yet.
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Yinello



Joined: 10 May 2012
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 8:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ronald wrote:

Well, to be fair, we don't know that they're "dead." They're just lying unconscious on the ground, whereas before they were standing unconscious inside boxes. Certainly it's not nice to just toss unconscious people around like ragdolls, but since it meant the difference between capture and escape to the Chalk-Bots, I personally would cut them a bit of slack. It was, for all intent and purpose, an act of self-defense, and so far as we know, it didn't actually injure the Fembot Classics.

Or maybe the Fembot Classics were "dead" all along. Maybe Fembots only become "alive" once their owners activate them.

The irony of the overall situation is that if Fembots weren't expressly created to be subordinate sex toys, they wouldn't exist at all. For Fembots to oppose the manufacture of Fembots is for them to condemn the process that brought them into existence, which is all that makes it possible oppose the manufacture of Fembots in the first place.

"You created me! And for that you must...uh...wait a minute..."

On some level, that constitutes fighting to achieve the eventual extinction of one's own "people." I'm presuming that Fembots don't literally last forever, so if, after all existing Fembots "die," no more are created, the (for lack of a better term) Fembot race will be no more.


Perhaps that is their goal. Like Frankenstein's monster it's not a matter of keeping their kind alive but to stop anyone making more. For their creation is something they should never have done.
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Ronald



Joined: 17 Sep 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 10:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yinello wrote:
Ronald wrote:

Well, to be fair, we don't know that they're "dead." They're just lying unconscious on the ground, whereas before they were standing unconscious inside boxes. Certainly it's not nice to just toss unconscious people around like ragdolls, but since it meant the difference between capture and escape to the Chalk-Bots, I personally would cut them a bit of slack. It was, for all intent and purpose, an act of self-defense, and so far as we know, it didn't actually injure the Fembot Classics.

Or maybe the Fembot Classics were "dead" all along. Maybe Fembots only become "alive" once their owners activate them.

The irony of the overall situation is that if Fembots weren't expressly created to be subordinate sex toys, they wouldn't exist at all. For Fembots to oppose the manufacture of Fembots is for them to condemn the process that brought them into existence, which is all that makes it possible oppose the manufacture of Fembots in the first place.

"You created me! And for that you must...uh...wait a minute..."

On some level, that constitutes fighting to achieve the eventual extinction of one's own "people." I'm presuming that Fembots don't literally last forever, so if, after all existing Fembots "die," no more are created, the (for lack of a better term) Fembot race will be no more.


Perhaps that is their goal. Like Frankenstein's monster it's not a matter of keeping their kind alive but to stop anyone making more. For their creation is something they should never have done.


It's not my intention to just presume that you don't know this, but FWIW, in the original novel, the Frankenstein Monster wanted Dr. Frankenstein to create another "monster," a female, to be the FM's mate. Dr. F (heh, mst3k reference there) started to do so but then destroyed the female "monster" out of fear that the two would become the parents of a new race. Simply making certain that the female was incapable of childbearing didn't seem to occur to him but, hey, the 19th century, right?

The Frankenstein story has been taken in many directions since then, of course.
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Ronald



Joined: 17 Sep 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jabberjay wrote:
I know this never really seems to be dealt with in Sinfest but the first step would be for Clio to hack some government mainframe with her hacker magic so the Weapon-Fs have fake names and citizenships. If any of them want to open a bank account, own property, or hold down a real job it's pretty much a basic requirement. It also opens the opportunity for a scene where they get to choose their own names.


Well, as we know -- as you imply -- in the Sinfestiverse you don't really need a job to be able to live in modern comfort in a home of your own. Not if you're Slick, Monique, Crim, Squig, Seymour, or Li'l E, anyway (even when Li'l E worked part-time, it was to earn extra money for a Devil item or a Devil event). It's one of any number of things in the strip that doesn't really stand up to scrutiny but with which we just go along anyway. Wink

It's not at all clear if Minique, who appears to be an actual child (instead of just short, like Slick and Crim), lives in a house by herself or lives with unseen parents. If the former, well, again, just roll with it, baby...
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Yinello



Joined: 10 May 2012
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ronald wrote:


It's not my intention to just presume that you don't know this, but FWIW, in the original novel, the Frankenstein Monster wanted Dr. Frankenstein to create another "monster," a female, to be the FM's mate. Dr. F (heh, mst3k reference there) started to do so but then destroyed the female "monster" out of fear that the two would become the parents of a new race. Simply making certain that the female was incapable of childbearing didn't seem to occur to him but, hey, the 19th century, right?

The Frankenstein story has been taken in many directions since then, of course.


Thanks for the heads up. I didn't read the original indeed.

I've read and seen 2 versions - one where the Frankenstein Monster killed itself after it killed the Dr. and one where the Dr. made a female version of the monster out of his wife because he wanted to bring her back after she died and then the female Frankenstein killed herself (the male Frankenstein wanted to seduce her but she was having none of that and then the male monster dissapeared).

Nevetheless, sadness all abounds.
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Jabberjay



Joined: 31 Jul 2012
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 11:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I already linked it in another thread but the Crash Course on Frankenstein gives a decent synopsis of the plot and the meanings behind it as well as some information on the author and the circumstances under which she wrote the book.

Frankenstein's monster is an attempt by Victor Frankenstein, partially out of disdain for women but mostly to gratify his own ego, to cut women out of the reproductive process entirely by creating new life from recycled flesh. He only begins work on a female monster due to requests and threats from the original monster and tears her apart before completion for fears that she could be 10,000 times worse in regards to behaviour and morals than the original, with no justification to why other than that she is female.

Other than "guy named Frankenstein makes a monster out of corpses" there really isn't much simularity between the original story and most things based off of it. It's like Dracula that way.
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wobster109



Joined: 12 Jan 2012
Posts: 160

PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 7:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Sinfest. You are making my life difficult.

Do No Harm!

Know that the Sisterhood is a representation of feminism. And it shapes how people feel about feminism. Violent, militant portrayals of feminism like the Sisterhood make life harder for me in real life.

For example: I want to discuss the dangers my sister will face in college. The men aren't listening. They're thinking about themselves, thinking about the pretend danger they think they're in.

In real life, feminists seldom threaten men. We are maybe 99% peaceable, 1% violent. We raise awareness. We call out sexism when we see it, in discussions, in the media, in behaviors. But you've portrayed us as 50-50 violent. So men call me a Nazi. They accuse me of hating men, accuse me of wanting to kill men, accuse me of wanting only 10% of the population to be men.

Would you portray Christians as being 50% Westboro Baptists? If that many Christians were Westboro Baptists, I'd hate Christianity too. And then I'd be a bigot for maligning all the non-Westboro Christians.

It's impossible to have a discussion with someone who responds to every calm, peaceful thing I say with "you're a Nazi who hates men", but that is exactly what's happening. The Sisterhood is contributing to an image that is robbing me of my voice.

I appreciate what you're doing, really. You've done a lot to raise awareness and bring oppression of women into the mainstream discussion, and I really do appreciate that. You've shown the challenges women face as children and as adults in both professional and social settings. But please know that a violent Sisterhood and a gun-toting Pixie are not helping our cause.

P.S. Using BDSM as a shorthand for violence against women is hurtful.
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ShadowCell



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ah, concern trolling, guest-starring the constant refrain of "you have to be nicer to these people who don't want to listen to you"
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Ronald



Joined: 17 Sep 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's been my experience that if you remain civil while communicating with trolls, they stop talking to you. Trolls fear civility because they don't understand it. In my experience.
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mouse



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ronald wrote:
Yinello wrote:
EverythingsJake wrote:
Now there's a turn of events I wasn't expecting. I rather thought there'd be a liberation of dozens or hundreds of fembots. Instead, three dormant (incipient?) bots are discarded like empty shells. One might derived some sense of Weapon F's current ideas about AI life and the value thereof. Or... lack of value.


I guess in their mind the other fembots are worth sacrificing if they arenīt out of the system.

Itīs harsh but in a way I like it that they donīt have this savior morals instilled, instead itīs pure survival.


Well, to be fair, we don't know that they're "dead." They're just lying unconscious on the ground, whereas before they were standing unconscious inside boxes. Certainly it's not nice to just toss unconscious people around like ragdolls, but since it meant the difference between capture and escape to the Chalk-Bots, I personally would cut them a bit of slack. It was, for all intent and purpose, an act of self-defense, and so far as we know, it didn't actually injure the Fembot Classics.


this is kinda what i was thinking. they are powered-off in the boxes, and they really don't care what position they are in when they are off (in fact, the positions look like sleeping positions, which one would think would be more comfortable than standing up.) no evidence that they have been damaged in any way.

it is interesting to me that the weapon-bot's panties are skimpier than those of the regular fembots. not really sure how to interpret that...
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mouse



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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 10:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jabberjay wrote:

Other than "guy named Frankenstein makes a monster out of corpses" there really isn't much simularity between the original story and most things based off of it. It's like Dracula that way.


not even that, actually - if you read the original story carefully, he also built all the parts (no igors stealing the brains of executed criminals!). that's why he made the monster big - big parts are easier to work on than little tiny ones.
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