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reshaping the u.s. supreme court, take 1: souter
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mouse



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2009 10:20 pm    Post subject: reshaping the u.s. supreme court, take 1: souter Reply with quote

so supreme court justice david souter is retiring - at the quite young age of 69. he tends to be one of the liberals, so obama's choice shouldn't change the conservative/liberal distribution. but hey - we needn't let that stop rampant speculation!

i like to think of who else might go in the next 4 years. the current lineup:
chief justice roberts, 54, conservative: probably in for anther couple decades, at least.
john paul stevens, 89: currently seems to most consistently be the swing vote. on age alone, he should be the next one going.
antonin scalia, 73, conservative: he looks like the kind that will hang on until death, if not after.
anthony kennedy, 72, conservative
clarence thomas, 60, conservative: he's never struck me as much of a worker. maybe he'll decide to retire at 65?
ruth bader ginsberg, 76, liberal: recent bout with pancreatic cancer; although it seems to have been caught early, and the prognosis is good, her health may make her leave sooner than she might want to.
stephen breyer, 70, liberal
samuel alito, 59, conservative.

my betting would be that stevens will retire before the end of obama's first term; ginsberg might as well. the hard-core conservatives unfortunately, are the youngest - scalia, at 73, is over 10 years older than dubya's picks, and as supreme court justices go, not all that elderly. that would make kennedy, at 72, the best shot for making some change in the makeup of the court.

of course, the conservatives are already lining up to insist on a conservative nominee - which undoubtedly means working hard to shoot down everyone else, since i can't see obama nominating someone they would actually approve of.
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CTrees



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PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2009 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But hey, with a little luck, they may not be able to successfully filibuster Obama's nominees!
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ShadowCell



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PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2009 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Either that or he'll pick people who opined much on the sort of issues that conservatives' panties in a wad. With nothing to bitch about, they'll pretty much have to let the nominee go through if there's no question of competence.

Downside of that, of course, is that you may have no idea who you're appointing to the court.
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mouse



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PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2009 11:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

well, apparently you never do - there seem to be a number of justices who ended up ruling in ways that made the presidents who nominated them quite unhappy.

actually, i think souter is one of those - he was nominated by bush I.
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Sam



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PostPosted: Sat May 02, 2009 1:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the republicans had gone along to some degree with Obama's tactical bipartisan 'olive branch', they could have used this as a litmus test for the reality of Obama's bipartisanship and exercised greater control over the moderacy of Obama's pick to replace souter.

As it is though they've sorta jacked that opportunity :/
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Mindslicer



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PostPosted: Sat May 02, 2009 4:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Had their been such an olive branch, that might be the case.
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nathan



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PostPosted: Sat May 02, 2009 5:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

After years of hearing that anyone who opposes the president's position - for whatever reason - is intentionally "coddling terrorists," and is knowingly and willfully acting against the interests of their own nation, what exactly are the criteria by which we are defining a political "olive branch?"
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CTrees



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PostPosted: Sat May 02, 2009 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mindslicer wrote:
Had their been such an olive branch, that might be the case.


Yeah! Oh wait. They're not even in line with their own statements regarding political "olive branches."
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Sam



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PostPosted: Sat May 02, 2009 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mindslicer wrote:
Had their been such an olive branch, that might be the case.


Not only was there an olive branch (or rather, an 'olive branch,' as I correctly dramatized it through special characters) but the republican response to it was both disingenuous and self-defeating.

Realistically, the minority leadership intended to court the bipartisanship issue only long enough to try to make it a Great Failing on Obama's part, so that they could sell gullible conservatives "that wasn't a real attempt at bipartisanship!"

There were two errors, though: one was evidence that they refused to even follow their own story involving the compromise offers, proving duplicity and fabrication on their part. The second was Obama's actions not exactly being something they could tear him down for. "Obama doesn't fold to us when we refuse to compromise!" is not exactly the sort of whining and fingerpointing that endears them to moderates.
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Mizike



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PostPosted: Sat May 02, 2009 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Um, Kennedy is the swing vote on this court. He leans slightly conservative but he's still the swing.
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Mindslicer



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PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2009 3:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CTrees wrote:
Mindslicer wrote:
Had their been such an olive branch, that might be the case.


Yeah! Oh wait. They're not even in line with their own statements regarding political "olive branches."


FiveThirtyEight is hardly an unbiased source for material. Note how they spin the Representative's suggestion that as many as 30 or 40 Republicans might have been swayed to vote differently to him 'promising' 30 to 40 votes. Fortunately they cited their article (quite correctly) as a superficial analysis.

By contrast, the Democrats were so certain they they weren't being bipartisan that they flew Senator Sherrod Brown back to Washington between his mother's wake and funeral in order to rubber-stamp the stimulus bill. I'm sure he had plenty of time and nothing more pressing on his mind at the time so be able to, you know, read the bill before casting his vote, right?
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kamineko



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PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2009 4:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mindslicer wrote:

FiveThirtyEight is hardly an unbiased source for material. Note how they spin the Representative's suggestion that as many as 30 or 40 Republicans might have been swayed to vote differently to him 'promising' 30 to 40 votes. Fortunately they cited their article (quite correctly) as a superficial analysis.

By contrast, the Democrats were so certain they they weren't being bipartisan that they flew Senator Sherrod Brown back to Washington between his mother's wake and funeral in order to rubber-stamp the stimulus bill. I'm sure he had plenty of time and nothing more pressing on his mind at the time so be able to, you know, read the bill before casting his vote, right?
Most people in congress, democrat or republican, don't bother to read the bills in which they are signing.

Most people in congress, democrat or republican, tend to speak in pure talking points then ever actually doing any real thinking. (or taking any real action)

When Bush was in power the Republicans were vilified for it, now the Dems are, really it's something they both do. Politics in front of progress is the name of the game.

That said, what you're bringing forward here as an example of the democrats being wholly partisan is tenuous at best. At the end of the day, the democratic majority felt the bill HAD to pass (the bill at that point was already a compromise bill) and did what they felt they had to.

I think before this continues any further, you probably ought to explain what you expect a real "bipartisan" congress to look like.
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Mindslicer



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PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2009 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah, the 'but the other guys did it too!' response. Predictably immaterial.

Democrat or Republican, that's not the right way to govern, and they both should be vilified for it.
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Major Tom



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PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2009 11:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mindslicer wrote:
CTrees wrote:
Mindslicer wrote:
Had their been such an olive branch, that might be the case.


Yeah! Oh wait. They're not even in line with their own statements regarding political "olive branches."


FiveThirtyEight is hardly an unbiased source for material. Note how they spin the Representative's suggestion that as many as 30 or 40 Republicans might have been swayed to vote differently to him 'promising' 30 to 40 votes. Fortunately they cited their article (quite correctly) as a superficial analysis.


i don't see the spin nor the concept of 'promise' that you cite in that post.
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Mindslicer



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PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2009 12:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Major Tom wrote:
Mindslicer wrote:
CTrees wrote:
Mindslicer wrote:
Had their been such an olive branch, that might be the case.


Yeah! Oh wait. They're not even in line with their own statements regarding political "olive branches."


FiveThirtyEight is hardly an unbiased source for material. Note how they spin the Representative's suggestion that as many as 30 or 40 Republicans might have been swayed to vote differently to him 'promising' 30 to 40 votes. Fortunately they cited their article (quite correctly) as a superficial analysis.


i don't see the spin nor the concept of 'promise' that you cite in that post.


The article quotes Bill McGurn as writing in the Wall Street Journal:

Quote:
Michigan Rep. Thaddeus McCotter suggests, for example, infrastructure as one area popular with some of his fellow Republicans. Had Democrats added, say, a few more infrastructure projects, perhaps a half-dozen Republicans in the Senate and as many as 30 or 40 in the House might have signed on. But the White House went the other way.


The end of the article states:

Quote:
Obviously this is a superficial analysis. But if Republicans were looking for a small compromise of the nature that McCotter suggested, they got one -- and none of the 30 or 40 swing votes that McCotter had promised were swayed.


---

On a totally different tack, this was a nice article about Justice Souter. Weare and the other nearby towns are a beautiful rural part of southern NH.
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