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Catel
Joined: 16 Nov 2009
Posts: 326
Location: France
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 Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 7:43 am Post subject: |
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| The Highlord wrote: | | Willem wrote: | So it's basically a "Do whatever the fuck you want" clause?
And inciting hatred isn't enough? It has to be violence? |
Pretty much. Unless it can be classed as harassment, libel, slander, or an incitement to violence |
Is it not ? |
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ShadowCell
Joined: 03 Aug 2008
Posts: 5243
Location: California
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 7:55 am Post subject: |
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speech that calls for violence only counts as incitement to violence if the threat of violence is imminent.
if this guy, for example, tells his followers to go out into the city, find some Muslims, and kill 'em, that would be incitement to violence. if he is not specifically telling his audience to get up and go kill some Muslims, then it's not incitement to violence, because the threat is not imminent.
the standard is much stricter in the US than it is in other parts of the Western world. |
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Catel
Joined: 16 Nov 2009
Posts: 326
Location: France
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 9:16 am Post subject: |
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| OK. So it doesn't work if he incites muslims to violence. Thanks. |
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Willem
Joined: 09 Jul 2006
Posts: 6306
Location: wasteland style
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:10 pm Post subject: |
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| ShadowCell wrote: | | speech that calls for violence only counts as incitement to violence if the threat of violence is imminent. |
So, if I were to say: "We'll show these Muslims what's what. Find out where they live and show them what real muricans look like! But don't hurt 'em, we'se above that."
Or if I were to give out detailed directions to a mosque to an angry mob...
I wouldn't be directly inciting violence, so I'd be safe?
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attitude of a street punk, only cutting selected words out of context to get onself excuse to let one's dirty mouth loose |
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Chocolatefan
Joined: 19 Feb 2008
Posts: 253
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:40 pm Post subject: Re: Stay warm, snuggle up near a burning koran! |
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| Quote: | "We have firmly made up our mind, but at the same time, we are definitely praying about it," said Jones
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Uh... |
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Dennis J. Squidbunny
Joined: 09 Jul 2006
Posts: 3522
Location: AUSTRALIA YOU FAKIR
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Willem wrote: | | ShadowCell wrote: | | speech that calls for violence only counts as incitement to violence if the threat of violence is imminent. |
So, if I were to say: "We'll show these Muslims what's what. Find out where they live and show them what real muricans look like! But don't hurt 'em, we'se above that."
Or if I were to give out detailed directions to a mosque to an angry mob...
I wouldn't be directly inciting violence, so I'd be safe? |
People in Australia, and I feel this probably happens in England too with young people especially, will invoke their first right amendments when speaking hatefully. Which is good comedy!
In Australia we have a recurring circus with an Islamic Cleric who gives these amazing hate-inciting speeches.
I think the difference is, if someone says 'these people are fucked and you should kill them' it doesn't matter what you say next, whether you say 'come kill them with me' or 'but we should not kill them', in Australia at least, any rhetoric that implies you should be violent towards another person or race is considered illegal and violence-inciting. But we have no first amendment. We just have the gist of it.
What a weird post.
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"Eight hundred pounds of nitro, his boots are thunder as he plays." |
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WheelsOfConfusion
Joined: 09 Jul 2006
Posts: 11131
Location: Unknown Kaddath
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 3:15 pm Post subject: |
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In the US, with the right to free speech being written into the highest law of the land, the bar is always set high when it comes to issues of which kinds of speech are actually criminal.
Except for certain cuss words on broadcast TV and radio.
It's kind of sad that the FCC is more concerned about the word "shit" than racial slurs. If I had to pick one or the other, I know which would be more harmful for impressionable children to hear. |
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Major Tom
Joined: 09 Jul 2006
Posts: 7562
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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| when your crazy scheme has lost joe lieberman... |
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tinkeringIdiot
Joined: 13 Oct 2008
Posts: 1057
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 4:58 pm Post subject: |
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| When ignorant people exercise their 1st amendment right to spew hate in public, the rest of us (read: we, the people) should exercise our 1st amendment right to call them out in public. The 1st amendment doesn't prevent citizens from voicing their opposition to the views of other citizens. |
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ShadowCell
Joined: 03 Aug 2008
Posts: 5243
Location: California
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 5:18 pm Post subject: Re: Stay warm, snuggle up near a burning koran! |
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| Chocolatefan wrote: | | Quote: | "We have firmly made up our mind, but at the same time, we are definitely praying about it," said Jones
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Uh... |
yeah, they're praying that their hateful, bigoted PR stunt isn't construed by its targets as hateful and bigoted.
GOOD LUCK WITH THAT GUYS, i wonder if you'll pray that your hateful, bigoted PR stunt doesn't get any American soldiers killed. |
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Lemontree
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 3297
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Dogen
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 9278
Location: Bellingham, WA
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 6:02 pm Post subject: |
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I'm #999.
_________________
"Worse comes to worst, my people come first, but my tribe lives on every country on earth. I’ll do anything to protect them from hurt, the human race is what I serve." - Baba Brinkman |
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Lemontree
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 3297
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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Yours is cooler. I was #979.  |
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ShadowCell
Joined: 03 Aug 2008
Posts: 5243
Location: California
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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| pah, and i was 987 |
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ShadowCell
Joined: 03 Aug 2008
Posts: 5243
Location: California
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