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School shooting at Dawson in Montreal
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Teh Digital Dragon



Joined: 09 Jul 2006
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Location: THE WORLD OF LARNING.

PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 2:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Major Tom wrote:
true.

i'm curious, though - is that at at least part of the cultural difference?
not the subway shooting, but the fact that your streetcops are unarmed.

it only make sense to me that it would make armed cops in a highschool alien to you, since unarmed urban cops seems insane to me.

I think it probably comes back to the difference between the gun crime rates. Because british police officers are unlikely to be confronted by someone witha gun, it makes sense for them not to be armed. Because british schools are very unlikely to see a shooting it seems insane to me for armed cops to be there.
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Major Tom



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok. i do pity us 'gun toters', in that sense.

it strikes me as a stereotypically pure view of england, though. i do admit that this is because i assume there is more violent crime, and specifically involving gun violence than you let on, or know...

...it's just so strange for me to think there's a little overpopulated island across the pond that takes all its misplaced aggression out on one another by way of bludgeoning.

...still...seat of the industrial revolution and all...it's so inefficient....
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WheelsOfConfusion



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Major Tom wrote:
...it's just so strange for me to think there's a little overpopulated island across the pond that takes all its misplaced aggression out on one another by way of bludgeoning.

Bludgeoning and stabbing.
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Major Tom



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ooo, good point.
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WheelsOfConfusion



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Major Tom wrote:
ooo, good point.

But still, you have to get up close to pull that off. That's living on the edge.
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Major Tom



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stare it in the face -- a real slice of life experience.
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WheelsOfConfusion



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 4:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Major Tom wrote:
stare it in the face -- a real slice of life experience.

If you're desperate enough to shiv a cop, you're already in it up to the hilt.
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Sojobo



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 4:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

But if you're just not that sharp, it might be less desperation than taking a stab at getting famous.
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Desire



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 5:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darqcyde wrote:

That's where you're wrong. My old high school has a VERY high percentage of youth who emigrated from inner city NYC and Philly and other unsavory urban areas. To some of those kids an unarmed officer would not intimidate them in the least bit. I know of at least 3 people who were expelled while I was in high school for bringing guns to school, several more for knives and such. Gotta love those gangstas Confused



I used to bring knives to school. Used to wear them, even. Used to have a length of chain I's either wear as a belt or wrapped around my boot ankle. Spikes and crap. There are many ways to conceal a weapon. I used to let my heels wear to the nail and would use it like a hammer to hit someone if I had to (you'd be surprised how much it can hurt). Hell, a small can of hairspray and a lighter can be an effective emergency weapon.

And I was pretty harmless. Though my HS principal was afraid of me. Rolling Eyes

Guns were brought to school more then the admins or teachers ever realized. They were more worried about the drug issues in the school. But even with the narcs and all, they only ever just barely scratched the surface of the drug culture there. Pretty ineffectual, all-in-all.

Now of course, my old HS is like a fort to get into. Lock downs and guards and metal detectors and everything. *shrugs* Maybe it is better.

Of course, the area I grew up in is right across the river from Philly and right next to Camden, so probably not your typical HS.
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rm



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 9:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

just in, more school shooting business, in colorado again...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060927/ap_on_re_us/school_evacuation
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Darqcyde



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Teh Digital Dragon wrote:

I doubt thatís exactly a typical experience. In the uk gun crime in schools is pretty rare, so itís difficult to see how introducing police with guns to the learning environment can be justified. And while I understand that such incidents are more common in the states I find it diffcult to believe theyíre such a present threat in most schools that a permanent armed guard is really neccesary.


My point is that while it is not necessary everywhere, in some areas it is necessary.
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Teh Digital Dragon



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 11:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Major Tom wrote:
ok. i do pity us 'gun toters', in that sense.

it strikes me as a stereotypically pure view of england, though. i do admit that this is because i assume there is more violent crime, and specifically involving gun violence than you let on, or know...

...it's just so strange for me to think there's a little overpopulated island across the pond that takes all its misplaced aggression out on one another by way of bludgeoning.

...still...seat of the industrial revolution and all...it's so inefficient....

I never said there wasn't violence, but rates of gun crime in the UK are undeniably many times lower than those in the US. You seem pissed off by this but my point wasn't "engurland pwns u", I'm just trying to explain why we don't have metal detectors in school or armed police in the street.
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Teh Digital Dragon



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 11:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darqcyde wrote:
Teh Digital Dragon wrote:

I doubt thatís exactly a typical experience. In the uk gun crime in schools is pretty rare, so itís difficult to see how introducing police with guns to the learning environment can be justified. And while I understand that such incidents are more common in the states I find it diffcult to believe theyíre such a present threat in most schools that a permanent armed guard is really neccesary.


My point is that while it is not necessary everywhere, in some areas it is necessary.

I'm not really qualified to judge, but I find it difficult to believe there are that many schools where serious gun crime is such a regular occurence to justify permanant armed police.
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Darqcyde



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 12:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Teh Digital Dragon wrote:
Darqcyde wrote:
Teh Digital Dragon wrote:

I doubt thatís exactly a typical experience. In the uk gun crime in schools is pretty rare, so itís difficult to see how introducing police with guns to the learning environment can be justified. And while I understand that such incidents are more common in the states I find it diffcult to believe theyíre such a present threat in most schools that a permanent armed guard is really neccesary.


My point is that while it is not necessary everywhere, in some areas it is necessary.

I'm not really qualified to judge, but I find it difficult to believe there are that many schools where serious gun crime is such a regular occurence to justify permanant armed police.


I'm sure the idea of maintaining a visible deterrant plays a factor. Here's an example of some of the worse mentality. Sophomore year during a Anti-drug assembly one kid stood up in the middle of it and yealled "Fuck you! Fuck your system! Fuck your laws! I make a grand a day selling drugs. Drugs are great. I'm outta here." Then he walked out of the auditorium. I don't know the exact outcome, but I'm assuming he got expelled since I don't recall ever seeing him in school again.

*Edit I remember when I first saw the movie Traffic I was reminded of this during Topher Grace's little speech about minorities being hit up for drugs constantly.
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Last edited by Darqcyde on Thu Sep 28, 2006 3:39 am; edited 2 times in total
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Major Tom



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 3:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Teh Digital Dragon wrote:
...You seem pissed off by this...


nononono, honest. i was funnin' ya.

we were almost having a moment, there, and it made me all uncomfortable.
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