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Gibson22
Joined: 01 Jul 2012
Posts: 301
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 Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Why thank you. (See what I did there, Arioch? Mental gymnastics. I can make myself believe anything). |
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ShadowCell
Joined: 02 Aug 2008
Posts: 7394
Location: California
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| Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 2:44 pm Post subject: |
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| which, sadly, does not make it true |
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Gibson22
Joined: 01 Jul 2012
Posts: 301
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| Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 2:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Why thank you, Shadow. You don't have to do that, but I appreciate it. |
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sporko
Joined: 09 Jul 2006
Posts: 2900
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| Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 2:59 pm Post subject: |
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dipshits
wat r u doing
dipshits
staaaaahp
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Gibson22
Joined: 01 Jul 2012
Posts: 301
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| Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 3:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Oh my! Sporko! ...Here? With everybody watching? Are you sure that's a good idea? |
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Heretical Rants
Joined: 20 Jul 2009
Posts: 5344
Location: No.
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| Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 3:04 pm Post subject: |
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You're ruining all of the non-negative sentiments I previously had about this thread, Gibson.
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Gibson22
Joined: 01 Jul 2012
Posts: 301
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| Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 3:06 pm Post subject: |
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| D'aw...I just wanted to see how far it would have to go for me to get his silence... ;_; Fine...I'll step back into reality again. For now. |
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Succubus1982
Joined: 07 Oct 2009
Posts: 919
Location: England
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| Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 3:15 pm Post subject: |
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Actually I'm not 'offended' about the word tame. It just bothers me the lengths Arioch is going to, to try and proove he's right and everyone else is wrong. Why not just say 'Okay thats your opinion, mines different' and be done with it?
Also for some reason he comes across like a really smug know it all. That also yanks my chain. I'm compelled to get into arguements with people like that, I can't help myself. So yes Arioch you're right, I could ignore this thread but I don't. Why? Because I'm compelled to keep arguing with you, because you annoy me. Which makes you reply and annoy me more. Vicious circle I know, but here we are. |
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Heretical Rants
Joined: 20 Jul 2009
Posts: 5344
Location: No.
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| Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 3:16 pm Post subject: |
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Oh good, 'twas a shitposting contest.
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Gibson22
Joined: 01 Jul 2012
Posts: 301
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| Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 3:20 pm Post subject: |
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| I was going to post really dirty sounding stuff as it kept going and if anyone asked I was just going to say I was only talking about making clam chowder to share with everyone and that they should get their heads out of the gutter. |
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Gibson22
Joined: 01 Jul 2012
Posts: 301
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| Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 3:30 pm Post subject: |
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Actually, Shadow put up something that brought back a memory. I lived in the Philippines for a while and the people there usually study English as their second language. They pronounce "Oblige" like "oblig" and I notice that Spanish speakers do the same thing. (It's understandable of course, since it is harder for them to make the "briDGE" sound. I assume it's as hard for them as us learning how to trill the double rr's like "perro"). However, we told her it was "oblige" and not "oblig". She told us "Well, that is how we say it here" and my friend replied, "Well, that is how we say it in English speaking countries, so there you go."
TL;DR, Succubus, I see your point. Go nuts. Besides, this is all fun to read. |
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Succubus1982
Joined: 07 Oct 2009
Posts: 919
Location: England
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| Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 3:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Heretical Rants wrote: | | Oh good, 'twas a shitposting contest. |
Isn't that the case with everything posted on here? 
| Gibson22 wrote: | | I notice that Spanish speakers do the same thing. (It's understandable of course, since it is harder for them to make the "briDGE" sound. I assume it's as hard for them as us learning how to trill the double rr's like "perro" |
Yeah I'm learning Spanish and I have issues with the pronounciation and my Spanish speaking friends think it's a riot. |
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Dennis J. Squidbunny
Joined: 09 Jul 2006
Posts: 3879
Location: AUSTRALIA YOU FAKIR
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| Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Gibson22 wrote: | | I was going to post really dirty sounding stuff as it kept going and if anyone asked I was just going to say I was only talking about making clam chowder to share with everyone and that they should get their heads out of the gutter. |
alas! if only you'd followed through! clam chowder! |
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Samsally
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 7461
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| Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:29 pm Post subject: |
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I feel vaguely responsible for all this.
I... I'm sorry.*
*But I don't take back that talking about taming a person has gross connotations.
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mouse
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 20822
Location: under the bed
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 11:20 am Post subject: |
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| Arioch wrote: | | mouse wrote: | | ok, i have no idea what on earth you are talking about now. where did the fox come in? |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Little_Prince
But the name and short extract would probably tell you nothing.
So why bother.
| mouse wrote: | | but you know, when you come right down to it.....i kinda gotta point out that i am a native english speaker, and you are not. so really, i think i have a better idea of the english definition of 'tamed' is. and it's not what you are trying to make it be. |
I don not tell you what this word means in English, i explain you what it means in Russian and why "befriended" is probably closest concept yet still not the same. Well, probably that is not concept your language needs to express more or less often. |
ok - i was sufficiently curious that i finally read "the little prince".
all i can say is, the fox's definition of 'tame' is what i would characterize as non-standard. and from everything else the fox said, i would say it did not in fact want to be tamed, it wanted love.
compare the fox's definition of how 'taming' feels, compared to how you feel towards a person you love. excited when you know you are about to see that person? things that formerly meant nothing now mean something, because you associate them with that person? and of course, you miss them and cry when they are gone. that's love, friend. that's not being tamed.
consider also the relationships between the prince and the fox and the prince and the pilot. in many ways, they are similar - the prince accustomed the pilot to his presence, the pilot grieves at his loss - just like the fox. the fox now has the wheat to remind him of the prince, and the pilot has the stars (and probably sheep). but the pilot never uses the word 'tame' in reference to the relationship - he uses the word 'friend'.
i don't know why saint-exupery used 'tame' instead of something else. i don't know if it is due a limited word-choice in french, or because french has different associations with the word than english does, or maybe just because he figures a fox wouldn't have or wouldn't want to speak the word 'love' - maybe 'tame' is the closest a fox can get. in any event, it's a choice made by the author/translator - not a definitive use of the word. it just happens to be (apparently) your only experience with it.
and yes, you have spent a lot of time in this thread insisting that 'tame' means what you think it means, not what i (and others) have told you it means. and whatever gibson thinks, 'tame' is not an appropriate word to use between two humans; it implies a relationship in which one is master and the other is demeaned. "the taming of the shrew" clearly involves humiliation of "the shrew' (even that characterization shows that people think badly of her). although you originally mentioned the word 'befriended', this is the first time you came out and said it was the closest to what you meant. you want to be careful of things like that on this forum - people are perfectly capable of remember what is said here, and will call you on it if you try to say you said something else.
and i really don't know what you mean by saying english doesn't need to express the concept of .... what? befriending? loving? needing? we have all those concepts, and even those words. i don't know whether you mean to or not, but when you say things like this, you sound dismissive and contemptuous of english, and by extension, english speakers. just because you (and sometimes even i) don't know the proper english word, doesn't mean english and the people who speak it don't have the concepts.
anyway, i have now finally read "the little prince". yay!
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