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2013-1-30 Patriarchy Blockers Engaged
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Ronald



Joined: 17 Sep 2007
Posts: 3247

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Leohan wrote:
I mean, I did say that feminism wasn't the problem at all here. I even specifically wrote that 'Nique's big change happened in the environmentalism stage, it's just more notorious now. Ronald took the hard job of pointing out several instances where 'Nique has different attitudes than she currently does in strips where sexuality isn't explored at all.


Thank you. Smile

ShadowCell wrote:
so how is this version of 'Nique so horrendously different from the 'Nique who picketed on Uncle Sam's lawn and tried to unionize the devil girls

i mean it's sort of suspicious that you choose to go back to the earliest parts of the archive and ignore the stuff in between, where this character shifts and changes gradually over the course of, y'know, thirteen years


Yeah, that might be really suspicious, all right, except that I'm posting the strips in chronological order. As of 2007 'Nique hadn't yet done any of those things.
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fritterdonut



Joined: 24 Jul 2012
Posts: 1191
Location: Hedonism

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To be fair. that is a span of 6 years. I would think that most people change over a period of 6 years, especially younger people like Monique.
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ktern



Joined: 02 Jul 2007
Posts: 950

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 11:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

comic characters don't age in real time. hell, days in sinfest last weeks more or less

that said, that's long enough for tat to change, so there you go
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Ronald



Joined: 17 Sep 2007
Posts: 3247

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

addendum:

As a matter of fact, Uncle Sam didn't even appear as a character until 2008.
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ShadowCell



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
Posts: 6080
Location: California

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

you are aware that it's 2013 now, right?
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Ronald



Joined: 17 Sep 2007
Posts: 3247

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ShadowCell wrote:
you are aware that it's 2013 now, right?


Yes. My point, such as it was, was that any strip prior to 2008 could not contain Uncle Sam, whether being picketed by 'Nique or otherwise, so any expectation of such a strip would be even more ridiculous than initially implied.

Since I perceive no compelling reason to cease my endeavor, here are the debatably "different kind of zest for life" 'Nique strips for 2008.


http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=2697

http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=2726

http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=2761

http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=2835

http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=2837

http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=2853
(and others directly following this one)

http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=2886
(this one's not really a zest-for-life strip, but it shows 'Nique in a perspective which she's since outgrown, which is marginally related)

And for 2009:


http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=3210

http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=3109

http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=3341
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Succubus1982



Joined: 07 Oct 2009
Posts: 919
Location: England

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No compelling reason for you Ronald is anyone with a drop of common sense telling you no and that you're wasting your time. Because you've decided you're going to do it and so regardless of how indepth they went in explaining why you shouldn't, you would keep on doing it. I have met many people with your sort of tenacious to the end stubborn as shit annoying personality and I know precisely your 'reasons' for continuing Mad
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Ronald



Joined: 17 Sep 2007
Posts: 3247

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 6:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Succubus1982 wrote:
No compelling reason for you Ronald is anyone with a drop of common sense telling you no and that you're wasting your time.


And I would find that compelling because...?

Anyway, it's my time to waste. I've seen plenty of posts from other people that I thought were wastes of time (not yours because, as noted, I don't find them memorable enough to form opinions on). Do you see me complaining about those? You do not. When I see a big block of text on a topic that doesn't interest me, I just ignore it.

Heck, I'm wasting my time just responding to you. Do you want me to stop doing that?

Succubus1982 wrote:
I know precisely your 'reasons' for continuing Mad


Really. If they consist of anything other "because I feel like it," I'd be very interested in knowing what they are. It's fascinating when someone else tells me why I do something, as if they know more about my motivations and personality (such as it is) than I do.
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Ronald



Joined: 17 Sep 2007
Posts: 3247

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 7:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On a separate note, 2010 had, as far as I could tell, no strips in which 'Nique demonstrated the particular brand of "zest for life" which she's supposedly lost, so I guess that's it, then. Hm.
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Rothide



Joined: 14 Jul 2012
Posts: 852

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 8:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ronald wrote:
On a separate note, 2010 had, as far as I could tell, no strips in which 'Nique demonstrated the particular brand of "zest for life" which she's supposedly lost, so I guess that's it, then. Hm.


Actually Id say continue to post the strips, we have evidence here that Monique had a certain type of personality, up till 2009 she acted zany and lived life to the fullest. Maybe we can see the downward trend that lead her to adopting this changed attitude?
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mouse



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 17282
Location: under the bed

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 9:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fritterdonut wrote:


The whole gender-role things confuses the hell out of me. Baking is a hobby of mine, but a number of people have told me it's a woman's hobby. At the same time, I come from a family that made it's bread and butter (oh ho!) for 3 or 4 generations as bakers. When did putting dough into an oven become gender-specific?

Same goes for gardening.


there's a division between doing something professionally, and doing it in the amateur, hobbyist, everyday sort of way.

so: women cook and bake (at home), but men are the big-time professional chefs and bakers.
women garden (in the back yard), but men do landscaping and garden design.
women sew (for their families), but men are the big-name fashion designers.

in short- if it is the sort of thing that is done within/for the family, something economical and practical, it's women's work. but when it makes you famous and gets you big bucks...then it becomes something men do (and women should stay out of).
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Ronald



Joined: 17 Sep 2007
Posts: 3247

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 10:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rothide wrote:
Ronald wrote:
On a separate note, 2010 had, as far as I could tell, no strips in which 'Nique demonstrated the particular brand of "zest for life" which she's supposedly lost, so I guess that's it, then. Hm.


Actually Id say continue to post the strips, we have evidence here that Monique had a certain type of personality, up till 2009 she acted zany and lived life to the fullest. Maybe we can see the downward trend that lead her to adopting this changed attitude?


Describing it as "downward" is sort of subjective. She changed, but whether for the better or worse is a matter of opinion.

During every year from which I've posted "zany 'Nique" strips, there were also plenty of strips where 'Nique was not particularly zany (which is purely subjective, anyway; there were plenty of strips where 'Nique had fun but didn't behave in what I would categorize as a "zany" way) and even a few where she was downright serious. The strips I've posted aren't intended to be a summary of 'Nique's total personality during those years, they're just examples of a single personality trait she rarely exhibits any more. Any real examination of how her character evolved would require samples of strips depicting her in every mood, and that wasn't my goal.

That said, 2008 marked the point where Tat (IMHO, anyway) started focusing more strongly on political content and expanding the strip's scope. The Devil Girls (introduced the previous year) became more prominent, as did Jesus and Buddha. Really, one of the reasons "zany 'Nique' strips decreased was because 'Nique strips decreased because Tat needed the space for other characters.

2009's when 'Nique became a Vegan, if that helps. As you can see, by that point, 'Nique's zaniness had been reduced to cosplay.

2010 had multiple "long-term" arcs: Fuchsia and Crim, Squig on the road, Slick being pulled into and escaping Hell, and others, so there was even less space for random wacky hijinx. Probably the most significant 'Nique development during that year was 'Nique dealing with her supposed role in "sending men to Hell," so that's a "serious" milestone right there.

At the start of said arc, she engaged in AFAIK her last bit of cosplay at Blue's booth, but I didn't include that strip because it ended up having serious overtones, plus compared to some of her other performances, it was kind of subdued.

http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=3729
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Succubus1982



Joined: 07 Oct 2009
Posts: 919
Location: England

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 11:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ronald wrote:
Succubus1982 wrote:
No compelling reason for you Ronald is anyone with a drop of common sense telling you no and that you're wasting your time.


And I would find that compelling because...?

Anyway, it's my time to waste. I've seen plenty of posts from other people that I thought were wastes of time (not yours because, as noted, I don't find them memorable enough to form opinions on). Do you see me complaining about those? You do not. When I see a big block of text on a topic that doesn't interest me, I just ignore it.

Heck, I'm wasting my time just responding to you. Do you want me to stop doing that?

Succubus1982 wrote:
I know precisely your 'reasons' for continuing Mad


Really. If they consist of anything other "because I feel like it," I'd be very interested in knowing what they are. It's fascinating when someone else tells me why I do something, as if they know more about my motivations and personality (such as it is) than I do.


Your response wholly prooves my point. And yes you are wasting time responding, you're just fuelling my theories about how much you love hearing yourself talk. Please go on. Keep posting. Continue prooving me right.
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MerchManDan



Joined: 20 Nov 2007
Posts: 2013
Location: Somewhere else.

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's kind of weird - but highly entertaining - how you're getting all worked up over nothing, Succubus.

Heretical Rants wrote:
I'm so very disappointed in all of you.

well, not all of you

several of you

If it helps cover all the bases, I'm rather disappointed in myself.
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mouse wrote:
almost a shame to waste dennis' talent on him.
except it's always a pleasure to see a good dennis insult.
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mouse



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 17282
Location: under the bed

PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

as you should be - hanging out in comic forums instead of doing something useful with your life!


...oh, wait......
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