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4/8/2013 - misguided
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Zhuinden



Joined: 02 Jul 2012
Posts: 290

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

crayven wrote:
Zhuinden wrote:
crayven wrote:

I'm sorry but hasn't "being problematic" made it so much fun back then, and so boring and bland now?
This is why a guy talking on TV for 12 hours with a monotone voice about boring mundane things is not fun, and a wacky guy doing crazy stunts and throwing pies in the face of passers-by IS funny.
Things out of the social norm are fun.
Tat has just shown he has caved in to political correctness - and that is the norm. He's not a.."rebel" anymore, he's not asking the dangerous questions anymore, he's not going against the wave - be it good or bad it's up for debate, at least he tried.


Excuse me, but are we reading the same comic?

"He's not a.."rebel" anymore, he's not asking the dangerous questions anymore, he's not going against the wave"? Can you be any more dense?

He's asking bigger questions than just randomly assing around with typical, unfounded stereotypes - he's actually attempting to make people introspect and realize their errors to actually create the so-called "equality" that you speak of. It's not done via offensive jokes - the medium is more refined, and less in-your-face. Did that really make it so hard to comprehend the purpose?

Some themes that have come up, that I'd consider quite important:
-The inequality and objectification of women (obviously) - as guys often see girls merely as in the "girls whom you have to get in a relationship with so you can have sex and that's all they really are, which is why guys and girls can't ever be friends" bullshit
-The lack of freedom of speech - that you can't share your opinion on things without a crowd of haters pretty much attacking you down just because they disapprove of what you have to say
-That people do all they can to harm and demonize others who differ from them and/or are part of a minority
-The people who talk about what is "right" and yet when no one sees doing the exact opposite of it, hypocrisy

And don't tell me the above list is not what the comic tends to be about, and that it's not an important question to ask that goes against typical behavior. It's a rebellion against the evils of the world, by making people see the problems through a somewhat simple and easily accessible form - a webcomic.

If you still believe he's not going "against the wave", you're probably doing something wrong.


- objectification, i don't care about that, it doesn't apply to how i think of women
-"that you can't share your opinion on things without a crowd of haters pretty much attacking you down just because they disapprove of what you have to say"
You mean like you just jumped me right now in pack of 4-5 ? Oh i get it, this is teaching by example. Point taken.
-"That people do all they can to harm and demonize others who differ from them and/or are part of a minority"
See the comments where i am called 'retard' for saying the artist shouldn't try to apologize for his earlier ( much funnier ) work. Again i am being , as you adequately put it, "demonized" ( and probably would be harmed if we would meet in person, most of you sound like violent sort of people by the hate comments alone ).
Again i am just basing my opinions on what i said and the...replies, i got.


I guess you've got a point. I shouldn't have used an offensive tone... especially considering that hostility breeds hostility, as we can see.

I think the moral of the story is that no good comes of insults.
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Dennis J. Squidbunny



Joined: 09 Jul 2006
Posts: 3752
Location: AUSTRALIA YOU FAKIR

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That moral is stupid, you fucking idiot.
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Eristae



Joined: 06 Apr 2013
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Iíve been reading this forum a bit, and I know that a lot of people are having issues with the direction Sinfest has gone. The posts complain a lot that Sinfest has changed, that these people think Sinfest isnít funny anymore, that theyíre going to quit reading it, that they are upset that Tat is disavowing some of his earlier work, and so on and so forth.
So I thought Iíd put my own perspective on this out there.

Iíve known about Sinfest for years and never liked it. And when I say I never liked it, I donít mean ďand I was sitting at my computer seething while writing up long posts containing all the faults I felt Sinfest had.Ē I mean ďI just wasnít interested.Ē I was linked to it multiple times by multiple people, but it just never caught me because the content never interested me. For example, when Monique was bamming people with her butt, there wasnít anything about it that made me want to read more. I didnít think it was funny, it wasnít relevant to my interest, and it was repetitively the case that it wasnít funny to me or relevant to my interests. So I didnít read it.

Now I read Sinfest every day. Itís one of the webcomics that I check daily in a time period in my life that I donít check very many. I have been profoundly touched by some of the comics (for example, the one about the feminist utopia where women could go for walks at night and thatís the end of the story) and I know others have been as well (when I tweeted a summary and link to the aforementioned comic, I got more retweets than I had ever gotten before).

Thus, while I certainly wonít sneer at anyone who decides to stop reading the comic because they no longer find it funny or relevant to their interests, I really do like the changes. Theyíve taken Sinfest from something I occasionally heard about but basically never even looked at to something I find great enjoyment in.
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Monkey Mcdermott



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 3316

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I won't sneer at people who choose to stop reading the comic because they don't like the direction it's taken either.


I'll sneer at and berate those who come onto a forum to whine about it rather than sending an email to the author or just quietly not showing up anymore, i mean how would i even know they were quitting if they didn't come rolling into a place to bother people who dont give a shit if they stop reading the comic or not with their whining?
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Zhuinden



Joined: 02 Jul 2012
Posts: 290

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dennis J. Squidbunny wrote:
That moral is stupid, you fucking idiot.

Nah, it's perfect. Laughing


But yes, if people just figured they don't like the comic and haven't for the last three years, they could just... stop visiting the site.

Considering, there's no going back. Tatsuya himself has declared this a while ago.



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Eristae



Joined: 06 Apr 2013
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 4:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

. . . people have been complaining about the route the comic is taking for three years? That's . . . impressive. There was a comic that I really liked and then (in my opinion) tanked spectacularly. I made one post in a thread that the authors were responding in, kept reading for a few more weeks, then stopped. Thereafter I might check in every couple of months to see if it had changed, only to find that they hadn't actually done anything in the interim.

So I admit that I'm surprised by the perseverance of those who are unhappy with the current comic content.
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ShadowCell



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
Posts: 6084
Location: California

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

in practice, it's not usually that they're unhappy with the direction Sinfest has taken so much as they are upset with the direction Sinfest has taken

which means practically every thread in here turns into some argument over feminism, with the occasional side of racism
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Zhuinden



Joined: 02 Jul 2012
Posts: 290

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eristae wrote:
. . . people have been complaining about the route the comic is taking for three years? That's . . . impressive.


I did an exact trace now and it's only one and a half.
Figured I might be off by twice the amount of time, I always am.


2011-10-03 is the first occurance of Xanthe and the Sisterhood that I've found.

Oh well, that's still impressive.
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Miss Magenta



Joined: 09 Jun 2011
Posts: 1945
Location: im probably asleep right now

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zhuinden wrote:
2011-10-03 is the first occurance of Xanthe and the Sisterhood that I've found.

Oh well, that's still impressive.


Actually, Xanthe's first official appearance is HERE:


and the first mention of the sisterhood is HERE:

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Zhuinden



Joined: 02 Jul 2012
Posts: 290

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

2007... Well, I guess I'll have to re-read the comic from scratch at some point, huh.
(Although I don't think they weren't as prominent as characters as they are now... of course, I could also be wrong about this...)

But that's somewhat where the patriarchy arc came in, and then on 2012-01-02:

I guess that "Starting Over" thing is what we see now.



Edit:

It appears to me that reading up from that point makes it easier to understand what's going on here.
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Miss Magenta



Joined: 09 Jun 2011
Posts: 1945
Location: im probably asleep right now

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zhuinden wrote:
(Although I don't think they weren't as prominent as characters as they are now... of course, I could also be wrong about this...)


You are correct in assuming this. They were, at that point in time, simply one-shot characters for the sake of a joke that were eventually revived and became quite important to the strip by some kind of miracle.

Well, of course when I say that I mean that it was a miracle to me because I had been hoping it'd happen for a really long time... it's not so much a miracle for those who aren't fond of the sisterhood, of course...
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wobster109



Joined: 12 Jan 2012
Posts: 160

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Cartoonist/Master/Mr. Ishida is doing a good thing with this arc. As long as there are people who would defend the promising futures of rapists while condemning the rape victim, as long as there are those who think it's funny to poke at an unconscious girl's genitals, as long as we continue to think drunk girls "deserve" what happens, then there is need for the Sisterhood's message.
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Finnegan



Joined: 01 May 2007
Posts: 1080
Location: in that cool mountain air, on an appalachian trail

PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I find it refreshing to see someone dramatically change their viewpoint and admit that they had gotten it wrong.
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