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2013-05-04: Zero Dark Liberty
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Dogen



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 10685
Location: Bellingham, WA

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 4:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Finnegan wrote:
bare in mind that I was raised catholic and was in catholic schools until college and I know that environment gave me a very skewed perspective of normal human sexuality. still I've encountered just about as many people for whom this holds true as people for who it doesn't.

Sure. Some people actually don't know exactly what they want - men and women. But it's not like you ask once and then give up, or start thinking women are lying to you. It's like science. You form a hypothesis (based on what she said), you experiment, you evaluate your data, and then you reach a conclusion (that worked!) or a new hypothesis (that didn't work, let's try something new).

Yeah, even my romance is tinged with nerdiness.
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Finnegan



Joined: 01 May 2007
Posts: 1080
Location: in that cool mountain air, on an appalachian trail

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 4:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dogen wrote:
Finnegan wrote:
bear in mind that I was raised catholic and was in catholic schools until college and I know that environment gave me a very skewed perspective of normal human sexuality. still I've encountered just about as many people for whom this holds true as people for who it doesn't.

Sure. Some people actually don't know exactly what they want - men and women. But it's not like you ask once and then give up, or start thinking women are lying to you. It's like science. You form a hypothesis (based on what she said), you experiment, you evaluate your data, and then you reach a conclusion (that worked!) or a new hypothesis (that didn't work, let's try something new).

Yeah, even my romance is tinged with nerdiness.


it's not that they don't know what they want but that they aren't always comfortable directing their partner to do what they want. granted this is completely anecdotal, drawn mostly from my own experiences, but there does seem to be some hesitation in explaining exactly what to do and how to do it. I don't know whether this is from sexual insecurity or out of concern that it will hurt their partner's feeling to make them think that they aren't any good in bed, I've gotten both impressions.
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WellYesYouMay



Joined: 23 Jul 2012
Posts: 49

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 4:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rothide, did you just mention The Cinema Snob? As in Brad Jones? Because if so, it is a seriously small internet.
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Rothide



Joined: 14 Jul 2012
Posts: 852

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 4:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On a last note, I wish tat wouldn't intermix a feminist and political idea, not because I don't want him to do these comics, I'm past caring about that and just living for the Lil'e/Orange and Fushia/Crim stories, but more for just simplicity sake.

I just don't want to see a comic where the police shut down Curly's booth because she doesn't have a valid ID on her.

I'm also wondering how after all of this is over (if it ever is over) how will the devil ever be considered a character again, for the longest time he was a sympathetic villain, but now he's the big bad, along with a few other powerful side characters. I wont see him as sympathetic at least, you can't feel sad about a guy that basically treats women like commodities in his porn empire or make the crap their watching.
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Rothide



Joined: 14 Jul 2012
Posts: 852

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 4:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

WellYesYouMay wrote:
Rothide, did you just mention The Cinema Snob? As in Brad Jones? Because if so, it is a seriously small internet.


Yes I did, and it is a small internet. But seriously, he would love to rip these a new one. Id love to see him take on the patriarchial movies too. "He just said I am a heterosexual over and over, yeah that really shows Masculinity, maybe to a fucking 6 year old, but masculinity none the less."
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WellYesYouMay



Joined: 23 Jul 2012
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PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 4:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rothide wrote:
WellYesYouMay wrote:
Rothide, did you just mention The Cinema Snob? As in Brad Jones? Because if so, it is a seriously small internet.


Yes I did, and it is a small internet. But seriously, he would love to rip these a new one. Id love to see him take on the patriarchial movies too. "He just said I am a heterosexual over and over, yeah that really shows Masculinity, maybe to a fucking 6 year old, but masculinity none the less."


Yes, yes he would. I haven't watched most of his shows, but I'm actually friends with him (I produced Game Boys and acted in several of the movies he made before becoming a big internet star), and I can tell you that he would love it.
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Rothide



Joined: 14 Jul 2012
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PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 4:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

WellYesYouMay wrote:
Rothide wrote:
WellYesYouMay wrote:
Rothide, did you just mention The Cinema Snob? As in Brad Jones? Because if so, it is a seriously small internet.


Yes I did, and it is a small internet. But seriously, he would love to rip these a new one. Id love to see him take on the patriarchial movies too. "He just said I am a heterosexual over and over, yeah that really shows Masculinity, maybe to a fucking 6 year old, but masculinity none the less."


Yes, yes he would. I haven't watched most of his shows, but I'm actually friends with him (I produced Game Boys and acted in several of the movies he made before becoming a big internet star), and I can tell you that he would love it.


Well that's awesome, could be total bullcrap, but still awesome if true nonetheless.
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Random Wanderer



Joined: 08 Jan 2012
Posts: 182

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 4:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dogen wrote:
Random Wanderer wrote:
Valerie wrote:
It's odd how it never seems to occur to men that they could try asking a woman what she wants.


I can't speak in terms of sex, but plenty of guys do indeed ask women what they want in general. The problem is the the women either won't tell them, or what they do tell them is untrue, incorrect, or incomplete (or, possibly instead of all the above, misunderstood). It has in fact become "common knowledge" at this point, which is why guys spend so much time looking elsewhere to try to figure out the answer.

None of this excuses Sam, I should say. There is no excuse for Sam.

I just... I don't... what does "incorrect" even mean in this instance?


It means I was being redundant. Either "untrue" or "incomplete" would include the same meaning I was thinking of for "incorrect." You may ignore the word if you wish. Or not, it makes little difference to me. I tend to ignore these threads beyond the first page or two, so I probably won't read much in the way of anyone's replies.
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WellYesYouMay



Joined: 23 Jul 2012
Posts: 49

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 4:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rothide wrote:
WellYesYouMay wrote:
Rothide wrote:
WellYesYouMay wrote:
Rothide, did you just mention The Cinema Snob? As in Brad Jones? Because if so, it is a seriously small internet.


Yes I did, and it is a small internet. But seriously, he would love to rip these a new one. Id love to see him take on the patriarchial movies too. "He just said I am a heterosexual over and over, yeah that really shows Masculinity, maybe to a fucking 6 year old, but masculinity none the less."


Yes, yes he would. I haven't watched most of his shows, but I'm actually friends with him (I produced Game Boys and acted in several of the movies he made before becoming a big internet star), and I can tell you that he would love it.


Well that's awesome, could be total bullcrap, but still awesome if true nonetheless.

Ha! I suppose so. I'm not sure why I would want to pretend that on the internet, but I suppose so. It gave me a "someone's walking over your grave" feeling when you mentioned him. I moved away before his internet projects really took off, so I suppose I'm still getting used to the idea of all my old friends being internet hot shots.
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Rothide



Joined: 14 Jul 2012
Posts: 852

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 4:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

WellYesYouMay wrote:
Rothide wrote:
WellYesYouMay wrote:
Rothide wrote:
WellYesYouMay wrote:
Rothide, did you just mention The Cinema Snob? As in Brad Jones? Because if so, it is a seriously small internet.


Yes I did, and it is a small internet. But seriously, he would love to rip these a new one. Id love to see him take on the patriarchial movies too. "He just said I am a heterosexual over and over, yeah that really shows Masculinity, maybe to a fucking 6 year old, but masculinity none the less."


Yes, yes he would. I haven't watched most of his shows, but I'm actually friends with him (I produced Game Boys and acted in several of the movies he made before becoming a big internet star), and I can tell you that he would love it.


Well that's awesome, could be total bullcrap, but still awesome if true nonetheless.

Ha! I suppose so. I'm not sure why I would want to pretend that on the internet, but I suppose so. It gave me a "someone's walking over your grave" feeling when you mentioned him. I moved away before his internet projects really took off, so I suppose I'm still getting used to the idea of all my old friends being internet hot shots.


Im not trying to be mean, just always raised with the idea that "paper will stay still for ANYTHING to be written on it." but I didn't mean to insult with that, and yeah, if one of my old friends became famous it would be really weird for me as well.
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WellYesYouMay



Joined: 23 Jul 2012
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PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 4:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rothide wrote:
WellYesYouMay wrote:
Rothide wrote:
WellYesYouMay wrote:
Rothide wrote:
WellYesYouMay wrote:
Rothide, did you just mention The Cinema Snob? As in Brad Jones? Because if so, it is a seriously small internet.


Yes I did, and it is a small internet. But seriously, he would love to rip these a new one. Id love to see him take on the patriarchial movies too. "He just said I am a heterosexual over and over, yeah that really shows Masculinity, maybe to a fucking 6 year old, but masculinity none the less."


Yes, yes he would. I haven't watched most of his shows, but I'm actually friends with him (I produced Game Boys and acted in several of the movies he made before becoming a big internet star), and I can tell you that he would love it.


Well that's awesome, could be total bullcrap, but still awesome if true nonetheless.

Ha! I suppose so. I'm not sure why I would want to pretend that on the internet, but I suppose so. It gave me a "someone's walking over your grave" feeling when you mentioned him. I moved away before his internet projects really took off, so I suppose I'm still getting used to the idea of all my old friends being internet hot shots.


Im not trying to be mean, just always raised with the idea that "paper will stay still for ANYTHING to be written on it." but I didn't mean to insult with that, and yeah, if one of my old friends became famous it would be really weird for me as well.

Totally makes sense. I'm not overly concerned or offended.
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Jody



Joined: 29 Apr 2013
Posts: 139

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 5:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pretty sure the point is that he DOESN'T really want to know what women want.

He wants to watch the torture porn, and that's his excuse.

Ol' Sam's addicted to torture porn.
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Finnegan



Joined: 01 May 2007
Posts: 1080
Location: in that cool mountain air, on an appalachian trail

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 5:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

given that it's a sam/ liberty comic I think it's more a commentary on america's use of torture than it is about porn. there has been a lot of press about guantanamo lately with something like 2/3 of the detainees going on a hunger strike. I don't doubt there are several levels of meaning though..
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Jody



Joined: 29 Apr 2013
Posts: 139

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 5:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Finnegan wrote:
given that it's a sam/ liberty comic I think it's more a commentary on america's use of torture than it is about porn. there has been a lot of press about guantanamo lately with something like 2/3 of the detainees going on a hunger strike. I don't doubt there are several levels of meaning though..


Yes, exactly. It's a pretty straightforward analogy.

Sam just loves his torture, and Liberty weeps.
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Mr Zero



Joined: 20 Oct 2009
Posts: 77

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2013 7:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is actually a very funny strip.
How girls work: "Being an enigma in a void OF NO ANSWERS, delivered unreliably and in a flirty fashion cannot have ANY drawbacks EVER!"
>gets surprized by her boyfriend watching porn to try to figure out the female sex drive.
How boys defend that: "Well it's your own fault for trying to manipulate The Guy into doing what you want when you could just speak plainly."
Of course he doen't know what women want. Women either give no answer, no straight answer, a flat-out lie, two opposing answers, or some language-breaking anti-answer. I think that women have some chromosonal flaw that makes them only ever JUST SAY IT when she's at the 'throwing things and yelling' stage of a surprize breakup.
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