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2013-Sep-14 "I don't wanna fight"
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Monkey Mcdermott



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 3333

PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wolfo wrote:



Put more effort into it, please.


Nah, the effort to find all the old arguments and link them to you only to have you dismiss them unread isn't worth it. You aren't worth the effort of anything other than short snotty replies brah.
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merest



Joined: 15 May 2011
Posts: 325

PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 3:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Istancow wrote:
Actually, I think last time we had this discussion, I made more or less the same analogy with a dinner party instead of a gallery. I can't remember what thread, though.


Personally, I agree with the gang-turf analogy, but I don't consider that an altogether bad thing. It is reminiscent of how the Greek Cynics philosophised in public spaces whilst shamelessly defecating, masturbating, eating, etc. To see an echo of that is genuinely interesting in its own right, even if one would hardly care to follow suit. I recommend that the chap who dislikes the manners of this place might consider approaching them in the spirit of a sociological study.
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Darqcyde



Joined: 11 Jul 2006
Posts: 10626
Location: A false vacuum abiding in ignorance.

PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 4:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh man, I gotta save this before you try to edit it and say "but . . . but I didn't say __________"

Wolfo wrote:
Usagi Miyamoto wrote:
Wolfo wrote:
How dare men be catered to for being the most willing to spend money. [citation needed]


You need a citation to prove that a male is more likely to spend money to buy a video game than a female?
Really?

I could see your argument if you're attempting to look only at the whole mobile/facebook "game" market, but that still seems inane.

Well, given the benefit of the doubt, citation from 2~ years ago specifically for "freemium" mobile gaming, where I would have assumed it would be a more than fair chance for it to go either way. But looks like male gamers are still the predominate ones.
And before you try and claim that overall it's "only 8%!," you should first realize that 8% of the total share in this context is a lot of money.

You could also take the heavily skewed approach, and look at how the publisher that is most vocal about "LGBT and women's rights" (EA) is only doing so as a straw-grab attempt to pull positive press, while they're consistently floundering and failing at their quarterly reviews.

You could also take the slightly less, but still sort of skewed approach of "if it didn't sell, it wouldn't still happen," which assumes a markets responsibility as consumers to buy or not buy a product that they deem not to their tastes. Meaning if a product exists, and continues to exists, there must be a suitable market with more than enough people supporting it. (And that it is within your responsibility as a consumer to continue to ignore it(as it is not in your own taste) if that is the case)

sunshine wrote:
Yes, how dare you expect to be treated as a human being! Oh Yinello, that is so selfish of you.


I'm fairly sure in the context of the argument, everyone is treated as a human being.
In fact, that is exactly what they are treated as. A blank human being with the only discernible difference between one or another is their own preference in what kind of video game they enjoy to play.


Wolfo wrote:
Kendra wrote:
Umm....just because a majority group of people pay more for a product, that doesn't mean that they have the right to bully the minority of people. It's called discrimination. I would love to play video games, but I have known too many women who have been harassed online simply for being female. Women who were told that they would be raped. Just because the majority does have the authority to bully and harass the minority, that doesn't mean they should.


You have the equality and freedom of choice to ignore a product.
Do not like the product? Ignore it. You don't have to buy it. Your rights are not being violated simply by it "existing," as much as you would like to think it does.

As far as your incredibly dumb example goes;
First, if your friend(s) were legitimately physically threatened to being raped in any credible fashion, it should be dealt with via proper channels. Which include reporting to the police of reported and violent sexual harassment.

Second, it is the internet. Being "threatened" is nothing new or special. I have been threatened bodily harm, threatened to be killed, threatened for my family to be killed, etc.
While you may consider it a more "serious" offense, it is nothing to be taken seriously in any facet. No, it's not acceptable. No, it's not something you "should" have to deal with. But a girl dealing with it is no different than anyone else, I assure you, everyone regardless of age, sex, orientation, etc. will receive some form of threat that is similar.

Third, I repeat, it's the internet. There is only as much information on it as you so desire. For all you know, I could be a Martian. This applies to yourself and your friends. Don't want to be "discriminated" for being a girl in an online game? Don't let them know you're a girl. It's that fucking simple.

If you want to try and claim "but why should I have to hide myself!?!?!?!" you should realize that this is not the cause of some overt discrimination within the group(s) concerned. It has nothing to do with an overt "patriarchal society." It has nothing to do with the demographic being sexist or racist. It has everything to do with being anonymous and being an asshole "for fun," as most people think in their minds that they "really want to do" but refrain from. And, being anonymous, allows them to fulfill that wish without it actually being tied to them.


Yinello wrote:
> Says equality is a warped and demented ideal


Why are you attempting to greentext somewhere that doesn't support it?

And nice job trying to imply my argument is something that it isn't.

First, I didn't mention anything about equality. I ctrl+f'd to make sure, your post is the first to mention it.
However, since you brought it up, that statement is technically correct.
"Equality" means different things to different people. Its also holds varying degrees of definitions in the law and can vary from country to country if not state to state.
To attempt to claim otherwise is foolish and mislead.
(and by definition, no one is equal and a society that limits or forces an "equality" is the definition of a dystopia)
But really, as much as I could go on and on about philosophy, it's an incredibly dumb subject and as I said - I never once mentioned equality. That was you.




Quote:
> Believes people who pay more are granted more rights than others

> Thinks gamers and games are equal to everyone


First, it's not about rights with who pays more. It's more about the right of the developers to choose their audience and who they pander to.
The fact that they often choose the market worth more money isn't much of a coincidence.

Second, again, I never mentioned equality. Moreover, I never mentioned how one person treated another either. You're just projecting your expectations of an argument when they don't exist.

Third, while it's a rather trite mention, games do in fact treat everyone equally. They're inanimate objects. They don't really treat anyone... in any way at all actually. They just sort of exist.
Now, if you have an issue with their message I can understand, but that's the developers. Not the game itself. But that just goes back to the original point of "if you don't like it, ignore it."

Quote:
So either Wolfo is an escaped government experiment or just suffers from another case of delusional dinglebro.

I expect this thread to become 20 pages or so. Don't dissapoint me guys.


I honestly can't tell if you're legitimately... as you present yourself, or if you're simply pretending to be an idiot and are posting here in an attempt to seek good company.


PS: Threats of acts of violence are not covered under free speech. Anyone claiming it is aren't versed in any form of law.


Wolfo wrote:
Monkey Mcdermott wrote:
Go fucking play in traffic you sack of shit.


You first, mr edgy mc edgemaster "I have to have a curse word twice a sentance and here my signature will double flick people off for even more attention xD"

Seriously, overuse them that much and they lose all meaning.


Kjralon wrote:
Wow, Wolfo is the dumbest person I have ever seen write something on this forum. Yes, I am keeping Rothide in mind.


Maybe you should check the mirror.
Your generalization skills and "I have to take everything serious" skills are astounding.

Quote:
I am a woman who plays video games and the people I play with don't know I'm female -- but I STILL have to hear and am hurt by the rape jokes and the constant sexist conversation and discrimination that occurs. It sucks, a lot. And the few times I've spoken up and said that it made me uncomfortable, the only response I (usually) get is, "Are you a fucking woman? Do you want to get raped too?"


Tip for you.

Just because you choose to associate yourself with teenagers(that you have the choice to not associate with) does not mean you are allowed to generalize everyone to be exactly the same.

Or wait. Are you one of those people that join a public server and then not only do you read the public chat, do you take it seriously?
If that is the case, just stop playing online video games. It is not your thing. Quit forcing yourself into something you do not enjoy.

Also, whether you like it or not, the word "rape" has multiple definitions.
Just like cock, ass, fag, dike, etc. It can and does mean different things in context.

Quote:
Gamers are a special breed of misogynist assholes.


No.
They are assholes. The "misogynist" is your placing yourself as a sex above everyone else and claiming your special. I assure you, the generalization does not discriminate.


Wolfo wrote:
Darqcyde wrote:

Ok you are just wrong and pretty much everything. First off, what you claim to be saying, and what your post say are two different things.



How am I wrong? Simply stating "you're wrong" doesn't do anything.


Quote:
About 4 years ago the video game market overtook the DVD/BluRay market in terms of not only sales but profits, and the gap has only been growing. A simple google search literately produces hundreds of articles that supports this.

You can't say that the video game industry doesn't create real social injustices, it does. Something that large and influential does not exist in a vacuum. Again, simple google search, lots of results. Try, at least a little, to educate yourself before you inundate us with your logorrhea.


And?
Why don't you go wage a war on porn. It's much more deplorable.
Or go wage a war on pimps. Prostitution is even worse.

Quote:
But you only care about spouting your ignorant bullshit, posturing yourself as a "whoa is me victim" when you are not. Your lack of empathy and compassion is so apparent it's ridiculous. The Dunning-Kruger effect doesn't even begin to scratch the shell of haughtiness hubris you've girded yourself in.


I never posed myself as a victim.
I did state that everyone is a victim, but that's slightly different.
And please, explain how the dunning-kruger effect is even remotely relevant to the conversation.


Quote:
I'm not even going to try and explain how privileged you are, because I'm sure you will retort with something along the lines of "privilege is pseudo psycho babble bleeding heart feminazi garbage" or some other generic Limbaugh inspired shit.


Or are you trying to claim the dunning-kruger in your own faux construct?
Everyone is "privileged." There is no such thing as "eqaulity." You are better at things than I am, I am better at other things than you are. Some people have better social skills than others. It's called fucking life.

If you want to live in a dystopia, be my guest. But I'll not be joining you on that ride.

Quote:
Most importantly, you do not get to tell others how they are to react and not react, the world just doesn't work that way.


Nor do you get to impose your values of right and wrong onto others and expect them to feel the same.


Monkey Mcdermott wrote:
Yes we haven't heard this argument a million times from other mouthbreathers who slithered in to snivel about the subject matter of sinfest in recent years.


Put more effort into it, please.


Now I wonder if there are any contradictions in this steaming pile of logorrhea . . .
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ShadowCell



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
Posts: 6118
Location: California

PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 4:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

merest wrote:
I recommend that the chap who dislikes the manners of this place might consider approaching them in the spirit of a sociological study.


ah yes, "sociological study," the last refuge of an internet shithead who has neither the ability to argue a point persuasively nor the sense to leave a place he's not wanted
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baronskippy



Joined: 23 Mar 2009
Posts: 12

PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 4:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Monkey Mcdermott wrote:
Wolfo wrote:



Put more effort into it, please.


Nah, the effort to find all the old arguments and link them to you only to have you dismiss them unread isn't worth it. You aren't worth the effort of anything other than short snotty replies brah.


If you are not willing to press your point because you deem it worthless then it is worthless and so are you. Dismissing the point of view of another is negating your own point, not theirs, if you cannot defend it then it is not worth defending.

As and apathetic impartial observer feminists are rated among vegans that won't shut the fuck up. On the whole you piss and moan over minor problems and have no plan to tackle the bigger issues.

Don't insult or attack me for this observation, I would suggest you think about the actual solution but like most progressives you have no solution, simply a problem to complain about.

FYI. I have no solution to offer so don't muddy my statement by arguing that I have no solution, it's a complex sociological issue and your childlike fighting degrades the seriousness of the issue.
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merest



Joined: 15 May 2011
Posts: 325

PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 4:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ShadowCell wrote:
merest wrote:
I recommend that the chap who dislikes the manners of this place might consider approaching them in the spirit of a sociological study.


ah yes, "sociological study," the last refuge of an internet shithead who has neither the ability to argue a point persuasively nor the sense to leave a place he's not wanted


'Spirit of'. You left out the part that hopefully makes it less than condescending. Though I could understand if it struck you as otherwise.

Carry on.
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ShadowCell



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 5:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

merest wrote:
'Spirit of'. You left out the part that hopefully makes it less than condescending. Though I could understand if it struck you as otherwise.


the funny thing is it actually makes it more condescending

like baronskippy over there calling himself an "apathetic impartial observer" and then launching yet another ignorant, whiny attack on "feminists" and also throwing in "vegans" and "progressives" for good measure, none of which is "apathetic" and "impartial" and "observing" no matter how much glue you sniff! sorry, but you're not fooling anyone.
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Darqcyde



Joined: 11 Jul 2006
Posts: 10626
Location: A false vacuum abiding in ignorance.

PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 5:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

baronskippy wrote:
Monkey Mcdermott wrote:
Wolfo wrote:



Put more effort into it, please.


Nah, the effort to find all the old arguments and link them to you only to have you dismiss them unread isn't worth it. You aren't worth the effort of anything other than short snotty replies brah.


If you are not willing to press your point because you deem it worthless then it is worthless and so are you. Dismissing the point of view of another is negating your own point, not theirs, if you cannot defend it then it is not worth defending.

As and apathetic impartial observer feminists are rated among vegans that won't shut the fuck up. On the whole you piss and moan over minor problems and have no plan to tackle the bigger issues.

Don't insult or attack me for this observation, I would suggest you think about the actual solution but like most progressives you have no solution, simply a problem to complain about.

FYI. I have no solution to offer so don't muddy my statement by arguing that I have no solution, it's a complex sociological issue and your childlike fighting degrades the seriousness of the issue.


Oh man, this is awesome.
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baronskippy



Joined: 23 Mar 2009
Posts: 12

PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 5:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darqcyde wrote:
baronskippy wrote:
Monkey Mcdermott wrote:
Wolfo wrote:



Put more effort into it, please.


Nah, the effort to find all the old arguments and link them to you only to have you dismiss them unread isn't worth it. You aren't worth the effort of anything other than short snotty replies brah.


If you are not willing to press your point because you deem it worthless then it is worthless and so are you. Dismissing the point of view of another is negating your own point, not theirs, if you cannot defend it then it is not worth defending.

As and apathetic impartial observer feminists are rated among vegans that won't shut the fuck up. On the whole you piss and moan over minor problems and have no plan to tackle the bigger issues.

Don't insult or attack me for this observation, I would suggest you think about the actual solution but like most progressives you have no solution, simply a problem to complain about.

FYI. I have no solution to offer so don't muddy my statement by arguing that I have no solution, it's a complex sociological issue and your childlike fighting degrades the seriousness of the issue.


Oh man, this is awesome.


Why is it awesome? I would appreciate a coherent response.
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Sojobo



Joined: 12 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 5:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wolfo wrote:
Because something with a primary audience and a completely different demographic than your "special snowflake" group should still pander and befall to your incredibly warped and demented ideals.

Yinello wants women to be able to play video games without being constantly told they are going to get raped, and without constant use of femaleness being used as insult, such as "You play like a girl." and it's much more vicious cousins.

You refer to these desires as "warped and demented ideals".

That is crazy. If you honestly believe this, you are crazy. You began your participation in this thread with a completely batshit-insane unprovoked attack on someone who expressed sadness that people aren't nicer.

On this forum you'll see very mixed levels of courtesy to people who argue privilege doesn't exist. No one is entitled to courtesy by default, but some of us make the effort now and again, anyway, just in case.

Occasionally we find someone willing to admit that never having been on the oppressed side of the equation means they haven't been confronted with just how ubiquitous the injustice is, and that they might have something to learn about it.

That isn't going to be you. You are not going to find much courtesy here.

You will think it's because we're all feminazis, or because we are a cult, or some other pejorative that enables you to feel like the lone hero fighting back against incredible odds. Really, though, it is because you are an asshole.

Just thought you should know.

Cheers!
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Monkey Mcdermott



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 3333

PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 5:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

baronskippy wrote:
Monkey Mcdermott wrote:
Wolfo wrote:



Put more effort into it, please.


Nah, the effort to find all the old arguments and link them to you only to have you dismiss them unread isn't worth it. You aren't worth the effort of anything other than short snotty replies brah.


If you are not willing to press your point because you deem it worthless then it is worthless and so are you. Dismissing the point of view of another is negating your own point, not theirs, if you cannot defend it then it is not worth defending.

As and apathetic impartial observer feminists are rated among vegans that won't shut the fuck up. On the whole you piss and moan over minor problems and have no plan to tackle the bigger issues.

Don't insult or attack me for this observation, I would suggest you think about the actual solution but like most progressives you have no solution, simply a problem to complain about.

FYI. I have no solution to offer so don't muddy my statement by arguing that I have no solution, it's a complex sociological issue and your childlike fighting degrades the seriousness of the issue.


Meanwhile, you're still an unwelcome shithead.
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Darqcyde



Joined: 11 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 5:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

baronskippy wrote:
Darqcyde wrote:
baronskippy wrote:
Monkey Mcdermott wrote:
Wolfo wrote:



Put more effort into it, please.


Nah, the effort to find all the old arguments and link them to you only to have you dismiss them unread isn't worth it. You aren't worth the effort of anything other than short snotty replies brah.


If you are not willing to press your point because you deem it worthless then it is worthless and so are you. Dismissing the point of view of another is negating your own point, not theirs, if you cannot defend it then it is not worth defending.

As and apathetic impartial observer feminists are rated among vegans that won't shut the fuck up. On the whole you piss and moan over minor problems and have no plan to tackle the bigger issues.

Don't insult or attack me for this observation, I would suggest you think about the actual solution but like most progressives you have no solution, simply a problem to complain about.

FYI. I have no solution to offer so don't muddy my statement by arguing that I have no solution, it's a complex sociological issue and your childlike fighting degrades the seriousness of the issue.


Oh man, this is awesome.


Why is it awesome? I would appreciate a coherent response.


In short, you, and posters like you , Wolfo, Rothide, etc. are the reason for this:



How is that Irony NOT awesome, amirite? Wink
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Wolfo



Joined: 16 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 6:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sojobo wrote:

Yinello wants women to be able to play video games without being constantly told they are going to get raped, and without constant use of femaleness being used as insult, such as "You play like a girl." and it's much more vicious cousins.

You refer to these desires as "warped and demented ideals".

That is crazy. If you honestly believe this, you are crazy. You began your participation in this thread with a completely batshit-insane unprovoked attack on someone who expressed sadness that people aren't nicer.


I'm crazy because you expect no one to insult you in an online anonymous video game?
And you're really calling me the crazy one?

You could be the most "privileged" person on the earth and you will still be given shit by idiots on the internet. It is how things work. You are not special.

Jesus. You preach equality yet you place yourself up on a pedestal. It's the definition of hypocrisy.


Quote:
On this forum you'll see very mixed levels of courtesy to people who argue privilege doesn't exist. No one is entitled to courtesy by default, but some of us make the effort now and again, anyway, just in case.

Occasionally we find someone willing to admit that never having been on the oppressed side of the equation means they haven't been confronted with just how ubiquitous the injustice is, and that they might have something to learn about it.

That isn't going to be you. You are not going to find much courtesy here.


Um.
Okay?

You just spent a lot of words to say absolutely nothing other than "I don't like you."

Quote:
You will think it's because we're all feminazis, or because we are a cult, or some other pejorative that enables you to feel like the lone hero fighting back against incredible odds. Really, though, it is because you are an asshole.


Now you're just placing expectations on me.

I am, however, an asshole. I'm also narcissistic, pessimistic, a cynic and incredibly sarcastic.

Quote:
Just thought you should know.

Cheers!


I didn't care.

Cheers!



Darqcyde wrote:
In short, you, and posters like you , Wolfo, Rothide, etc. are the reason for this:



How is that Irony NOT awesome, amirite? Wink


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Moor



Joined: 07 May 2013
Posts: 318

PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 7:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wolfo wrote:
Sojobo wrote:
Just thought you should know.

Cheers!


I didn't care.

Cheers!


Drinks all around!

Cheers!


(I'd participate in the argument, but... nah. All the laughing and stuff has been done. And you've kinda wrecked the image-posting part by starting with a really big one; you should have started with just using them as basically expressive punctuation. -- these things need to build. I mean, unless you're in a rush or something. I suppose I shouldn't assume you're not. Sorry.)
(P.S. If you're gonna quote me and do more drinks, leave out my parentheticals so that it looks better. Thanks.)
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Darqcyde



Joined: 11 Jul 2006
Posts: 10626
Location: A false vacuum abiding in ignorance.

PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 7:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wolfo wrote:
Sojobo wrote:

Yinello wants women to be able to play video games without being constantly told they are going to get raped, and without constant use of femaleness being used as insult, such as "You play like a girl." and it's much more vicious cousins.

You refer to these desires as "warped and demented ideals".

That is crazy. If you honestly believe this, you are crazy. You began your participation in this thread with a completely batshit-insane unprovoked attack on someone who expressed sadness that people aren't nicer.


I'm crazy because you expect no one to insult you in an online anonymous video game?
And you're really calling me the crazy one?

You could be the most "privileged" person on the earth and you will still be given shit by idiots on the internet. It is how things work. You are not special.

Jesus. You preach equality yet you place yourself up on a pedestal. It's the definition of hypocrisy.


Quote:
On this forum you'll see very mixed levels of courtesy to people who argue privilege doesn't exist. No one is entitled to courtesy by default, but some of us make the effort now and again, anyway, just in case.

Occasionally we find someone willing to admit that never having been on the oppressed side of the equation means they haven't been confronted with just how ubiquitous the injustice is, and that they might have something to learn about it.

That isn't going to be you. You are not going to find much courtesy here.


Um.
Okay?

You just spent a lot of words to say absolutely nothing other than "I don't like you."

Quote:
You will think it's because we're all feminazis, or because we are a cult, or some other pejorative that enables you to feel like the lone hero fighting back against incredible odds. Really, though, it is because you are an asshole.


Now you're just placing expectations on me.

I am, however, an asshole. I'm also narcissistic, pessimistic, a cynic and incredibly sarcastic.

Quote:
Just thought you should know.

Cheers!


I didn't care.

Cheers!


Oh, how classic! The whole "I-don't-care-but-I-obviously-care-so-I'm-still-going-to-reply-routine" just never gets old.

I thought you were an A class troll, but no, sadly, I see you true ranking is B- at best, most likely C grade, kinda like the 'meat' they use in Taco Bell, but hey-- they've gone up from grade G meat, so know you're in good company.
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