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July 9: Release the Hounds
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mouse



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 6:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rothide wrote:

finding Buddy in Elf creepy to the point of being a rapist speaks louder than anything.


you think that because you know buddy's back story, and so you know (or at least believe) that he is harmless. you have been guided to see him as a sweet, hapless innocent, who has been dealt a rather rough hand - so of course you feel sorry for him.

the woman in question doesn't know anything of that. put yourself in her position for a second: naked, in the shower, alone in what you believe to be a safe place....and then suddenly, you are aware that there is a stranger there. a stranger focused on you. a stranger who is bigger and stronger than you. a stranger who is acting kind of weird, so you can't guess what he might do. or want. or react if you fail to respond the way he wants you to respond. and he's so weird you have no idea how he wants you to respond.

now how do you view buddy?
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Jabberjay



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Think of it this way...

You are in the shower. You are naked, singing, having a good time, and then somebody joins you singing. You look past the curtain. It's Will Ferrel.

I'd fucking scream.
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Rothide



Joined: 14 Jul 2012
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mouse wrote:
Echo wrote:
Yeah, but Milton's exactly the sort of self-centred little creep whose mind might be changed by having the weaponised fembots spare him. I mean, he'd never do it because not killing women is the right thing to do, but load him up with a sense of personal debt and there's a chance he might act differently.


or...the kind who is sufficiently terrorized by how close he came to being destroyed that he becomes highly reactionary and is eager to destroy malfunctioning fembots because those things can kill you (me)

after all, he doesn't know why the weaponized fembots spared him, or even that they did. they were there, they walked away - leaving him still bound to the table. they might be coming back.

and they didn't spare him even from the sense that life has value - they were rejecting their orders.

either way, i think this could be a turning point for milton. it will be interesting to see which way he goes.

assuming the remote self-destruct is not, in fact, for him.


Well, technically we haven't seen Milton FINE yet... for all we know the lazers were firing during the last memory and the comment was more "Now you can't give me orders anymore".
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Rothide



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mouse wrote:
Rothide wrote:

finding Buddy in Elf creepy to the point of being a rapist speaks louder than anything.


you think that because you know buddy's back story, and so you know (or at least believe) that he is harmless. you have been guided to see him as a sweet, hapless innocent, who has been dealt a rather rough hand - so of course you feel sorry for him.

the woman in question doesn't know anything of that. put yourself in her position for a second: naked, in the shower, alone in what you believe to be a safe place....and then suddenly, you are aware that there is a stranger there. a stranger focused on you. a stranger who is bigger and stronger than you. a stranger who is acting kind of weird, so you can't guess what he might do. or want. or react if you fail to respond the way he wants you to respond. and he's so weird you have no idea how he wants you to respond.

now how do you view buddy?


I would think it was weird, a little scared like she was, but considering I have seen him during the work day (If I'm remembering Elf right) and he acts this way, but was never violent toward anyone, I would be cautious at the most. That might be naive of me, but that's how I personally would react.

OK reviewing it a good kick in the nuts is appropriate too.

You know what, if people wanna put that spin on that scene, their fine to do so. I don't agree with it, but that's only on me.
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Monkey Mcdermott



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love the way rothide is completely unable to put himself in other peoples shoes. It's always how he himself in his own body would act in a situation.
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mouse



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rothide...you do realized that rapists don't just start grabbing women and slobbering all over them right in public, right? and abusers deal out most abuse in the privacy of the home, rather than out in public in front of witnesses? so the fact that someone does not do that in the work environment makes "cautious at most" a _definitely_ naive response.
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Rothide



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You know what, fuck it... I'm done, I dont know how we got onto fucking rape in the first place, my original topic was how Blue and Milton basically did the same, act of killing, but Blue gets preferential treatment "cause she's sympathetic".
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Rothide



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Monkey Mcdermott wrote:
I love the way rothide is completely unable to put himself in other peoples shoes. It's always how he himself in his own body would act in a situation.


She said "in her position" not "if you were her" but considering how I was raised, (and considering we have no backstory of this characters childhood) I was raised that rape is a possibility, but a good swift kick to the balls and a police call fixes things up pretty well. And if he's more powerful than me, she said to play along, massage him, make him think your into it, wait till his gaurd is down, massage the side of his head lovingly, then go The Moutain on his ass like he's the Viper.

At least that's what my Mom did when she was raped. I was raised by a rape survivor, and by the time my mom was done with him he was screaming in rage, but had no fucking clue where she ran off from. She said to the cops "Look for the guy with the dangling eyeballs".

My mom didn't care, she had God and Religion, she decided that this was supposed to happen "There are some fucked up people out there, and apparently God wanted me to blind one of them", and raised me on how to defend myself. She taught my sister the same thing. Neither of us really live in fear of rape.
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mouse



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 10:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jabberjay wrote:
Think of it this way...

You are in the shower. You are naked, singing, having a good time, and then somebody joins you singing. You look past the curtain. It's Will Ferrel.

I'd fucking scream.


well, there is that too, of course.
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Monkey Mcdermott



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 10:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interpreting it that way is stupid as hell, i'm 200 pounds of 6 foot tall hairy physical labor all my life dude. Even if the exact same thing happened to me I'm not in the same position as my 21 year old, pretty, 100 pounds MAYBE, six inches shorter than me co worker. Because there's a flat out better chance I won't be completely overpowered by someone creeping on me in the shower. You pretty much didn't bother actually thinking it through.
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Rothide



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Monkey Mcdermott wrote:
Interpreting it that way is stupid as hell, i'm 200 pounds of 6 foot tall hairy physical labor all my life dude. Even if the exact same thing happened to me I'm not in the same position as my 21 year old, pretty, 100 pounds MAYBE, six inches shorter than me co worker. Because there's a flat out better chance I won't be completely overpowered by someone creeping on me in the shower. You pretty much didn't bother actually thinking it through.


Sorry I take most things literal. "I was in her place" is different than "I was her".
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Monkey Mcdermott



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 10:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You aren't in the same place as someone half your physical size man the inability to grasp that point is a major part of why everyone here thinks you're an asshat.
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mouse



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 10:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rothide wrote:
Monkey Mcdermott wrote:
Interpreting it that way is stupid as hell, i'm 200 pounds of 6 foot tall hairy physical labor all my life dude. Even if the exact same thing happened to me I'm not in the same position as my 21 year old, pretty, 100 pounds MAYBE, six inches shorter than me co worker. Because there's a flat out better chance I won't be completely overpowered by someone creeping on me in the shower. You pretty much didn't bother actually thinking it through.


Sorry I take most things literal. "I was in her place" is different than "I was her".


well, that may be a language thing. generally, when you say "put yourself in someone's place", you pretty much do mean "imagine you are this person", because it assumes that you are bound by all the constrictions on the other person. so for example, telling bill gates to "put yourself in the position of a person trying to get a cab on a rainy night", you are pretty much including the caveat "and that you aren't so incredibly wealthy that you could just buy any car that rolls by and use that instead, plus providing the driver with a major cash bonus to make up for the inconvenience"...because otherwise, it's silly.

i'm glad your mother was able to fight off her attacker, but not everyone is able (or lucky enough) to do that. so that's were visualizing yourself as a generic sort of person becomes an important thought experiment.
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stripeypants



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 11:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rothide, you think people should like Milton. You are upset that people aren't giving Milton a chance. So I am providing an explanation of why I do not like Milton. And that is because he has no respect for boundaries and behaves like creepy people. Rape figures into this because that's part of what creeps do, and a big reason for why such behavior is inappropriate.

You can keep distancing yourself from it, thinking, "Oh, only the worst of people do that. I would never do that. Reasonable people never do that." You are allowed to live in your happy fantasy world where if everyone follows the rules that you grew up with, nothing bad will ever happen. Lucky you.

In the scenario with you in the shower singing and someone else waiting around, you're forgetting to imagine that they are potentially stronger than you, you are unarmed. And they've already expressed that they are attracted to you - and you've already tried to brush them off. There's no one else around. And they might be armed. Also, you are naked and wet in a room full of slippery surfaces, which hinders your escape.
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stripeypants



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 11:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also, I have to ask - do you share your mother's view? Do you think people who are raped have been ordained to receive this as part of some divine plan?
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