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July 26, 2014: Show me the files
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EverythingsJake



Joined: 26 Jun 2014
Posts: 301
Location: The Jazz Age

PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 2:53 am    Post subject: July 26, 2014: Show me the files Reply with quote



No comment at present. Talk amongst yourselves. I'm waiting for the meds to kick in. Damn cluster headaches/migraines/whatever the blazes they are.
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Jabberjay



Joined: 31 Jul 2012
Posts: 259

PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 3:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Exposition!

Milton still made the mistake of creating true A.I. instead of just a sufficiently-realistic V.I. It's like he never even saw Terminator 2: Judgement Day.

Also why no hunky mandroids? If someone were selling mandroids I'd buy two!
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Heretical Rants



Joined: 21 Jul 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 3:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jabberjay wrote:

Milton still made the mistake of creating true A.I. instead of just a sufficiently-realistic V.I. It's like he never even saw Terminator 2: Judgement Day.


what are you even talking about

a functional simulation of a person is itself a person
anything less would not work
you're only able to have rough approximations of other people in your head because you are able to run them on your own person-systems

also, one of this comic's most glaring flaws is a shitty reference to that movie

anything that references Terminator is dead to me
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Jabberjay



Joined: 31 Jul 2012
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 3:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are older, better versions of the same concept, some of which don't devolve into "KILL ALL HUMANS." Wintermute from William Gibson's Neuromancer is my favourite.

Also your statement is debatable. If they need to program a robot that can carry on a sophisticated and complex conversation with social cues and the whole works then that would probably require some level of self-awareness. If they're building a mobile humanoid fleshlight with the conversational depth of a cheap Japanese dating sim then self-awareness definitely isn't a priority. A decent AI for spatial awareness would be, though. Both for the sex and so they can make a decent tracking pattern when going from A to B.

They didn't have to be capable of being people to sell, that was a concious choice by their creator. I'm simply stating that is a bad idea on both a moral and practical level. At the very least make replicants instead, Blade Runner style, so their irreversable 4 year lifespan means they can't sustain an effective revolution, just sporadic serial-killing and terrorism.

If one must play God they should do it responsibly. Hand-in-the-cloud God clearly didn't and look at the mess that resulted. Milton has learned nothing.
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Heretical Rants



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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 4:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
At the very least make replicants instead, Blade Runner style, so their irreversable 4 year lifespan means they can't sustain an effective revolution, just sporadic serial-killing and terrorism.


that's an even worse idea

fucking hell

you do that and everyone is dead

Quote:
If they need to program a robot that can carry on a sophisticated and complex conversation with social cues and the whole works then that would probably require some level of self-awareness. If they're building a mobile humanoid fleshlight with the conversational depth of a cheap Japanese dating sim then self-awareness definitely isn't a priority.

the comic itself seems to be conflicted on this

in some strips they seem to just be selling sex, but in others they're selling the whole experience
(plus the stigma of dating a robot. You'd think Deviltech would try to combat that one if they're actually trying to sell these things)

Quote:

There are older, better versions of the same concept, some of which don't devolve into "KILL ALL HUMANS." Wintermute from William Gibson's Neuromancer is my favourite.


Sinfest directly uses Terminator's terminology (like "cpu" brains).

Quote:

Neuromancer


I only got about halfway through that one.
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stripeypants



Joined: 24 Feb 2013
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 4:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just to help me keep track of who everyone is in my head, Jabberjay, aren't you the person who insisted that no one should have transformation technology because of something you saw in Star Trek episodes?
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Jabberjay



Joined: 31 Jul 2012
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 4:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had to read it twice. This was partly because it was written during the phase of William Gibson's life in which he was trying, in his own words, to do "every drug known to man." I was also high as balls during the first read-through and missed a lot, so I read it again sober. The description of how decent chemical stimulants feel is pretty much spot-on. I can understand not wanting to finish it if you're not into the whole psychonaut/stonercore genre of sci-fi.

But long-story-short, Wintermute circumvents its anti-singuarity hardware via the human agents that are the protagonists, covertly absorbs every networked system on Earth and in orbit, and effectively becomes a newly-formed superintelligence that is the closest thing the planet has to a representative sentient conciousness. This is reinforced by a line in the last chapter stating that it made contact with a similar intelligence from another star system.

I think "don't make something as smart/smarter than you that is also capable of murder" is one of the most common re-occuring themes in all of sci-fi. My favourite versions involve murderous toys and murderous super-sharks that murder-interrupt Samuel L. Jackson.
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Jabberjay



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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 4:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stripeypants wrote:
Just to help me keep track of who everyone is in my head, Jabberjay, aren't you the person who insisted that no one should have transformation technology because of something you saw in Star Trek episodes?


Which Star Trek are we talking? In the original series' first season I honestly lost count of how many times random shit caused somebody to gain godlike power, at which point they immediately begin to abuse it. Old Star Trek was predictable-yet-wacky like that.

Nah, the reasons I don't think TF tech should ever exist cannot be linked on this board because the ability to erase short-term memory after leaving yourself a note not to click certain links doesn't exist yet. I wouldn't want to expose you to depictions of transformation that only brain-bleach can cure, if only because brain-bleach doesn't really exist.
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Heretical Rants



Joined: 21 Jul 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 4:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I think "don't make something as smart/smarter than you that is also capable of murder" is one of the most common re-occuring themes in all of sci-fi.


which is a shame, because the narrative of those same stories requires there to be something of a fair fight


but there is no fair fight to be had



wolves have claws and teeth and rudimentary intelligence

humans have very weak claws and teeth by comparison, and they are just slightly smarter than wolves -- on the scale between amoeba and human, wolves rank far closer to the human

humans wiped the wolves out in many places and could easily finish the job if they wanted


Neuromancer at least sounds somewhat reasonable.
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Heretical Rants



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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stripeypants wrote:
Just to help me keep track of who everyone is in my head, Jabberjay, aren't you the person who insisted that no one should have transformation technology because of something you saw in Star Trek episodes?


nah

that was their reason for distrusting nanotech

Jabberjay wrote:
Two thirds of the Deus Ex games and all of the borg episodes of Star Trek have convinced me that nanomachines are of fickle allegiance and may turn against their creators.


keeping nanotech in check is really easy

nanotech can't outsmart you

the only risks are that someone else will abuse it (a risk that comes with any technology), or that it will evolve in a manner akin to cancer. It can't evolve if it can't replicate, and even if you need it to self-replicate for some reason you can just encrypt/compress the replication instructions and then even the tiniest error in the replication of those instructions will result in completely non-functional instructions.
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Yinello



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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 4:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Slowww progression comic. Let's hope for epicness tomorrow.
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0z79



Joined: 06 May 2013
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 8:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Heretical Rants wrote:
Jabberjay wrote:

Milton still made the mistake of creating true A.I. instead of just a sufficiently-realistic V.I. It's like he never even saw Terminator 2: Judgement Day.


what are you even talking about

a functional simulation of a person is itself a person
anything less would not work
you're only able to have rough approximations of other people in your head because you are able to run them on your own person-systems

also, one of this comic's most glaring flaws is a shitty reference to that movie

anything that references Terminator is dead to me


I'm glad I never saw that movie; the first thing I thought of was a Virtual Intelligence ala Mass Effect, so the term isn't a four-letter-word for me. Smile
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Echo



Joined: 18 Jul 2013
Posts: 660

PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, so the question is, what's in this that Blue's going to care about?
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SA_Penguin



Joined: 13 Feb 2011
Posts: 231
Location: Adelaide

PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Echo wrote:
OK, so the question is, what's in this that Blue's going to care about?

Lil ' E - if she knows things about her boss, which he hides.
Sneaking a look through the big D's personal stuff is something I TOTALLY could see the "loyal" Blue doing. When he was off at a conference.
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Darqcyde



Joined: 11 Jul 2006
Posts: 10588
Location: A false vacuum abiding in ignorance.

PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2014 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Heretical Rants wrote:
stripeypants wrote:
Just to help me keep track of who everyone is in my head, Jabberjay, aren't you the person who insisted that no one should have transformation technology because of something you saw in Star Trek episodes?


nah

that was their reason for distrusting nanotech

Jabberjay wrote:
Two thirds of the Deus Ex games and all of the borg episodes of Star Trek have convinced me that nanomachines are of fickle allegiance and may turn against their creators.


keeping nanotech in check is really easy

nanotech can't outsmart you

the only risks are that someone else will abuse it (a risk that comes with any technology), or that it will evolve in a manner akin to cancer. It can't evolve if it can't replicate, and even if you need it to self-replicate for some reason you can just encrypt/compress the replication instructions and then even the tiniest error in the replication of those instructions will result in completely non-functional instructions.

What if you designed nanomachines that could exhibit and utilize colonial behaviors and mechanisms and that through such devices could more realistically threaten humans?

I think the greatest threat realistically though would be some sort of self replicating nanomachines designed to breakdown materials on an atomic level, like say ones that remove all the carbon from anything they interact with and poop out graphite dust or endless nanotubes. Those would be horrific.
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