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Hey, looky what I find here!
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mouse



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 17420
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MsFrisby wrote:
But, the thing is, life is not controllable. You really can't control everything that happens to you ever. She, of all people, should know this. To say, "I'm NEVER going to let ANYTHING control me ever again" is just kidding yourself. I think the reaction is totally understandable given the circumstances, I just am wary of utterly singleminded folk. I'm pleased that she seems to be directing it towards humanitarian work and not twisted supervillian revenge.


one wonders how emotionally mature she, since her only human interaction was with her kidnapper. she may still, emotionally, be closer to 10 - and kids don't necessarily understand or accept that there are things out of their control. she probably spent a lot of time thinking of things she might have done to keep from being caught - so even though she spent 8 years in captivity, she may still believe she _could_ have controlled that situation.

it does seem a bit cold - but again, she didn't really have the opportunity to develop normal feelings and relationships. it is amazing that she was able to preserve herself as an independent person - and probably shutting off her emotions was a necessary part of that.

and katrin - _both_ the people you quoted said the money wouldn't make up for the eight years. nothing in the article suggests that she has _not_ been damaged by this, and that it will not take her a long time to recover, if she ever does. i doubt anyone seriously thought that no one would ever make money off of this - it is a bit surprising that she was so in control of herself that she was able to take control of the situation almost immediately.

but whatever prediction points you got for that, you lose for completely failing to understand what other people said to you.
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Secret



Joined: 10 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 9:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Major Tom wrote:
i do find it somewhat cold, if not actually chilling, that she has had full presence of mind to manage her freedom as a brand name with all image aspects controlled and strong brand messages from moment one.


Yes.

It's sickening.

"Once I escape... I'll become a tragic hero and make millions!"
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Major Tom



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PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

didn't say sickening, said cold.
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MsFrisby



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PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 10:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I didn't say sickening either. It's more a wee bit unnerving than sickening.
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Katrin



Joined: 13 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 1:13 am    Post subject: Re: Hey, looky what I find here! Reply with quote

Azmoten wrote:
You probably missed the main point of my post, which was that it's not recompense for 8 years in some psycho dude's garage/basement/whatever.


You didn't actually read/skim the article did you?

*shrug*

As for the whole "Once I escape... I'll become a tragic hero and make millions!"

It's probably psychological.

And yah...

Quote:
and katrin - _both_ the people you quoted said the money wouldn't make up for the eight years. nothing in the article suggests that she has _not_ been damaged by this, and that it will not take her a long time to recover, if she ever does. i doubt anyone seriously thought that no one would ever make money off of this - it is a bit surprising that she was so in control of herself that she was able to take control of the situation almost immediately.

but whatever prediction points you got for that, you lose for completely failing to understand what other people said to you.


She did actually say that she had grown used to him.

And that she doesn't really want to see her parents anymore.

Apparently she's "grown" out of them both...

So yeah... you didn't actually read it either...
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Bart



Joined: 22 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 6:19 am    Post subject: Re: Hey, looky what I find here! Reply with quote

Katrin wrote:

Quote:
and katrin - _both_ the people you quoted said the money wouldn't make up for the eight years. nothing in the article suggests that she has _not_ been damaged by this, and that it will not take her a long time to recover, if she ever does. i doubt anyone seriously thought that no one would ever make money off of this - it is a bit surprising that she was so in control of herself that she was able to take control of the situation almost immediately.

but whatever prediction points you got for that, you lose for completely failing to understand what other people said to you.


She did actually say that she had grown used to him.

And that she doesn't really want to see her parents anymore.

Apparently she's "grown" out of them both...

So yeah... you didn't actually read it either...


I can just see her at a press conference: " Being kidnapped were the best years of my life, it's such a life chanching experience, everyone should try it. "
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death_to_dib



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PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I dont know that her plan is any stranger than say a man that was a POW in vietnam who constantly designed houses in his cell. People in situations like that need hope. They need to believe things are going to get better or else they end up resgning themselves to the situation. I know it probably sounds weird to us looking back that she ever thought she might get rich and famous off of rape but it might have been the only thing keeping her together.
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Marik



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PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 11:50 am    Post subject: we'll start with "Sciavo is dead" Reply with quote

I need to make threads about being right, too.
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Rosie Bee



Joined: 09 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On a slight downer of a note (since this is such a positive thread anyway Smile ) the BBC are now casting doubts on parts of her story. Which is nice of them.

Because obviously you can expect someone who has had effectively no social contact since the age of 10 to be perfectly normal, remember everything that's happened to them in the last 8 years, and be able to behave like an adult when it comes to being held against their will.

Oh who knows. It's here anyway - http://news.bbc.co.uk - first page, under Video and Audio News, cos I don't know how to link to the video.
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Thy Brilliance



Joined: 09 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 12:30 pm    Post subject: You were right about what now? Reply with quote

Ever hear of "Stockholm's Syndrome" Katrin?
Oooooh, wow I predicted that. Oooooh, she feels sympathetic to her captor, wowy.

$380,595
This is your "millions of dollars"? Let's just forget the fact that the psychiatrists are the ones making the big money.

Ooooh Book Deals/TV appearances? Interesting, let's see.
[Possibly] one book describing the experience, let's forget the cost of publishing and editors, let alone who else is writing the book.
And [possibly] a years worth of TV appearances before people stop caring about it.

Hmmm... I KNOW, she could become an ACTRESS!!!
With any luck, she might be a natural!! All she has to do is use all this publicity to jumpstart her career!!! SHE'LL MAKE BILLIONS!!!

Oh yes Katrin, Millions of dollars, what a fantasy world you live in.

Man, how the hell did I miss this thread?
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trustedfaith



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PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 2:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OMG U R SO RIGHT!!!!11

ALL HAIL KATRIN!

If you wanted to talk about the story, you didn't need to come off like a schmuck to do so.
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Azmoten



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 2:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So she's gonna make a few bucks off her experience as a kidnapping victim for eight years. So what? She can never buy back those eight years, she can never have a normal life. She will always wonder what she could have been if this had not happened. She will always remember those eight years locked in a basement, likely with a spine-tingling shiver accompanying the memories.

No matter what she says, no amount of money or material possessions will make that go away, or bring back to her the pieces of herself she lost forever.
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Fhqwhgads



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PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are sooo many ways in which I hate this thread...


...and yet I can't look away. Crying or Very sad
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mouse



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PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 8:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Hey, looky what I find here! Reply with quote

Katrin wrote:

Quote:
and katrin - _both_ the people you quoted said the money wouldn't make up for the eight years. nothing in the article suggests that she has _not_ been damaged by this, and that it will not take her a long time to recover, if she ever does. i doubt anyone seriously thought that no one would ever make money off of this - it is a bit surprising that she was so in control of herself that she was able to take control of the situation almost immediately.

but whatever prediction points you got for that, you lose for completely failing to understand what other people said to you.


She did actually say that she had grown used to him.

And that she doesn't really want to see her parents anymore.

Apparently she's "grown" out of them both...

So yeah... you didn't actually read it either...


yeah, i did. so your point is what - a girl imprisoned for 8 years, seeing only 1 person, admits she's grown used to him? well, what did you expect - that after 8 years, it would still be a surprise? so this somehow makes it ok that he held her in a basement all those years?

and does it occur to you that the estrangement from her parents might be a result of that captivity? that she might otherwise have a normal healthy relationship with them? that she may not be able to recover that relationship? how does the money make up for that?

and as i recall, part of the pain we were talking about was the pain her family must have felt, over all these years - how does this money make it all ok for them?

i'm tempted to ask what basement _you've_ been living in, but that would be mean.
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Katrin



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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2006 4:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

trustedfaith wrote:
OMG U R SO RIGHT!!!!11

ALL HAIL KATRIN!

If you wanted to talk about the story, you didn't need to come off like a schmuck to do so.


LAWL THX.

Now, at the moment, you all seem to be rather close-minded on this whole situation. How can you assume that she didn't actually enjoy that new life more then her old one? At the moment, she certainly has no desire to go back to it and she seems content to go out on her own. I'm not saying the money made up for anything, I never said it would, ever. I did say that she would make money and after reading this, it seems she's absolutely fine with that. She's had no cases of any sort of psychological disorders so far and they've had her in their custody for quite some time now, too. There were no hints of sexual abuse or whatever, so perhaps he did treat her well, perhaps he was just a disturbed man that wanted to care for a little girl as if she was his own real daughter, gently doting her and loving her, through a fatherly means.

And perhaps she grew to enjoy that more then the company of her parents.

We don't know.

But the reason I said "grew used" instead of "liked", was because I'm not sure if she really did. If she actually began to like him despite his crimes, that would be true Stockholm Syndrome, instead "growing used to" would be more like, tolerating something.

You all automatically assume that what happened to her must have been the most gruesome, terrible thing in the world. But honestly, there are worse things and millions of people manage to cope with it and live on, doing whatever they can to survive or whatever. They treat it as normal, just another part of their lives because while you cry about how she shall never know a normal childhood, the fact of the matter is, she doesn't know what one is, what does she know that she's missing?

Besides, you still assume that she even wants a normal life, how are we to know? We don't. So let me sum all this up into one easy-to-read sentece:

You can't imagine how she feels.

And now that I think about it, nor do you have the right to actually determine what would make her feel happier or better or whatever. Preach on about precious "memories" or "bonds" that she might've missed out or whatever, those are your views, not her's.
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