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January 18, 2018: oh, no
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netsplit



Joined: 13 Jan 2008
Posts: 65

PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Onimaru wrote:
netsplit wrote:
The manspreading is a subtle but appropriate addition by Tat.


Can I beg a question in ignorance here? What the blazes is 'Manspreading'? Every person I've seen accused of it is sitting in a way that is comfortable as a man, am I suddenly required to painfully crush my genitals by keeping my knees together now?

Is a woman who sits with her shoulders back so she's not uncomfortably crushing her breasts in her bra doing something wrong?

I mean what the hell, I get that if in a crowded area you sit with them closer together, or cross your ankles, but no man I know can sit for prolonged periods in an upright position with his knees together comfortably. Am I missing an important factor in what makes it 'manspreading' or what?


If setting without your legs spread eagle is causing you pain, you probably should see a doctor.
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Wic



Joined: 10 May 2015
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Taemon wrote:
Onimaru wrote:
netsplit wrote:
The manspreading is a subtle but appropriate addition by Tat.


Can I beg a question in ignorance here? What the blazes is 'Manspreading'? Every person I've seen accused of it is sitting in a way that is comfortable as a man, am I suddenly required to painfully crush my genitals by keeping my knees together now?

There's a difference between crushing your genitals and not taking up more space than you need. The sitting wide-legged that some men do, as in the comic above, has nothing to do with giving room to your balls. It's about taking up as much space as possible.

Also, you totally don't crush your breasts if you hunch your shoulders. That's not a thing.


How is it taking more space than needed? Don't they move their legs when told to scoot over? Or is it the mere sight of the male pelvic area that is the problem?
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mouse



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

apparently it really is an issue in places like the subway - a guy manspreading takes up not only his only seat, but two additional ones. and i gather the guys who do it are not real receptive to the idea that they should let other people have a little room. serious manspreaders do make it clear that it's all about keeping the space to themselves - whether it's the couch, a subway seat, wherever. the pimp, in this situation, is not exactly aggressively manspreading (no one else there to block) .... but it's sort of a highlight on his character.

personally, i think a woman faced with this situation should just sit on the guy's leg (and park her heaviest bag on his crotch), but i'm not in new york; some of those guys look like they have no sense of humor.

as a non-male person, i do have to wonder about this genital-crushing. if you sit with your legs coming straight out from your hips, your legs are as far apart as they are when you walk. so are guys crushing their genitals all the time when they walk? this seems like a very poor design.
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d5xtgr



Joined: 06 Mar 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

netsplit wrote:
Onimaru wrote:

I mean what the hell, I get that if in a crowded area you sit with them closer together, or cross your ankles, but no man I know can sit for prolonged periods in an upright position with his knees together comfortably. Am I missing an important factor in what makes it 'manspreading' or what?


If setting without your legs spread eagle is causing you pain, you probably should see a doctor.


I'd compare sitting with one's knees together to standing at attention, the strict military posture. While you can stand at attention or sit knees-clasped for a bit, it doesn't take too long for either to become uncomfortable - and yes, as time goes on, even painful. And so when you stand under normal civilian circumstances, you wouldn't typically be in the strict attention posture; in the same way, sitting with closed knees is unusual unless there's a reason - like cramped seating or wearing a kilt.

Yes, being unable to even briefly touch your knees together while seated might be cause to seek medical help, but the fact that it's just not that comfortable really isn't. There's plenty of reasons to condemn the pimp character, but harping on his seated posture isn't one - especially as his body is turned relative to his head so he's not "showing off" his crotch to Abby.

Uncle Sam sat in the same way last year when ordering his replacement mecha. I'd point out that based on how high those two characters' knees are drawn, the stool looks to be too short for them, which would also contribute.

mouse wrote:
if you sit with your legs coming straight out from your hips, your legs are as far apart as they are when you walk. so are guys crushing their genitals all the time when they walk?


Um, generally no. The genitals are fixed to the abdomen, not the legs. When standing or walking, they are mostly in front of the legs. When seated naturally, they fall mostly in the gap between the legs; it's just when seated knees-clenched they really get displaced. Sometimes an issue when it's more than walking - cycling, playing sports, etc. Hence the funny pants and underwear they market to cyclists and athletes.


Last edited by d5xtgr on Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:04 pm; edited 1 time in total
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mouse



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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

and yeah, i gotta say the showing-off of the male pelvic area is a bit off-putting. it comes off as some sort of primate sexual display. sorta like mandrills flaunting their colorful butts.
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netsplit



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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As a guy I can cross my legs as long as I like. The only issue is the bottom leg eventually falls asleep and gets numb where my top leg presses on it, but that's not a gender issue.

Generally stuff gets pushed out of the way of my legs in one direction or the other. Nothing gets trapped between them. Upright walking is millions of years old, evolution has had plenty of time to fix such issues with the body layout needed. There's no polite reason to need to set around spread eagle like that.

However there is one hazard. In the words my 7th grade gym teacher when we had some class involving a pummel horse "make sure your underwear is pulled up good. You land on a testicle and you're gonna know it"

Those words of inspiration have stuck with me through the decades.

So tl;dr; setting in pretty much any normal human position is fine, setting around advertising like Uncle Sam or the Pimp is considered rude in a lot circles. Be weary of pummel horses.
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Onimaru



Joined: 16 Apr 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK so it legitimately is a context situation, a display of dominance, refusal to move or 'show off' like some primal idiot monkey. Thank you for explaining.

However I think some people misunderstood when I said 'knees together', though d5xtgr mentioned a few good points and was close. I however was talking about sitting like the image on the left here:



I can sit like the image on the right, but the left causes me extreme personal discomfort, I don't know maybe it's weight related, or I'm just not flexible as I should be, but that both hurts my hips and crushes my genital area. So usually I sit with my feet tucked in and legs crossed at the ankles, but that's just comfortable for me, my knees do stick out but I can 'scootch' my legs together if I'm somewhere crowded without too much trouble, just if it's not crowded I don't think leaving ten centimeters between my knees when I sit is an act of Misandry.

And in relation to the breasts thing, my wife isn't heavily endowed, but she complains that if she sits forward with her elbows on her knees like I do while wearing an underwire bra, it's like crushing them or pushing them in awkward ways, not all the time, but in general she tends to prefer to sit with her back upright and shoulders back, it's more comfortable. Again this might only be her rather than all women, so I apologize for generalizing.
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mouse



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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

do an image search for 'manspreading' and you will get things like this:

and this:


and ....well, you get the idea. it's more than just american-style leg-crossing.

and as to your wife....based on personal experience, i would blame the underwire bra. those things are satin-covered torture devices.
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Wic



Joined: 10 May 2015
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

netsplit wrote:
However there is one hazard. In the words my 7th grade gym teacher when we had some class involving a pummel horse "make sure your underwear is pulled up good. You land on a testicle and you're gonna know it"

Those words of inspiration have stuck with me through the decades.

So tl;dr; setting in pretty much any normal human position is fine, setting around advertising like Uncle Sam or the Pimp is considered rude in a lot circles. Be weary of pummel horses.


In my school boys were relieved from using the pummel horse with the same reasoning.

Anyhow, I just played around with my chair, legs and balls I mean, I made some tests and I think I have finally cracked it.

If you have a computer chair that can be adjusted, first close your legs for a few minutes. Then, lower your chair as far as it goes and do the same. You will notice that when your chair is lower, the strain on keeping your legs together is stronger. You can relieve the strain by tucking your legs under the chair or straightening them forward, but this isn't necessarily possible in public places.

So the taller you are and the lower your seat is, the harder it is to not to manspread. I'm over six feet tall and I just realized why it's so hard for me to keep legs together in the bus.

The images mouse just posted illustrate it perfectly. If the seat is too low, you're not sitting, you're squatting.
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mouse



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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 6:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yeah neither of those images look like the seats are too low for the men in them.


but as to your point on pimp-guy - if the height of the stool is the problem, why does the devil booth have such a low stool? is it like the guest chair in mr. potter's office (in "it's a wonderful life") - done deliberately to put the other person in an uncomfortable/subordinate/humiliating posture? or is pimp-guy taking advantage of the situation? or is this just his normal deal? because the main reason his knees are so high is because he's wearing those ridiculous platform shoes.

and speaking of ridiculous - seriously, dude, shag?
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Last edited by mouse on Thu Jan 18, 2018 6:31 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Samsally



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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

if it's just about squatting strain i call bull. I'm tall and have literally never "manspread" to be more comfortable, despite many chairs being much too short for me
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d5xtgr



Joined: 06 Mar 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mouse wrote:
if the height of the stool is the problem, why does the devil booth have such a low stool?


Character height in Sinfest varies wildly. Even among "adult" characters, Slick's feet don't reach the ground when he sits on that stool, Fuchsia seems to be the right size, and Sam and this guy are in more of a squat or crouch than a seated position.

Onimaru wrote:
OK so it legitimately is a context situation, a display of dominance, refusal to move or 'show off' like some primal idiot monkey


Well, yes and no. People will still call it "manspreading" whether or not it's in a context of dominance, refusal to move, or monkey-advertising (the application of the term to the pimp in this comic, for instance, isn't really any of the three), because it's more fun to be sanctimonious than sensible.

And I think I have similar opinions as Onimaru and Wic on posture discomfort - sitting with the knees ~20cm apart is most comfortable, crossing the ankles with the knees ~10cm apart perfectly reasonable, pressing the knees completely together doable for a while, pretzelling the thighs as in Onimaru's leftmost diagram very uncomfortable. Lower seat height makes it harder, but an automotive-style bucket seat makes it easier. I'm not sure why netsplit and samsally have different experiences, though.
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Strix Varia



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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any chance that Tat simply has an easier time drawing a sitting man like that? I would point out that the devil girl has a total of five fingers on both hands combined. I highly doubt Tat is making a subtle comment about the number five being the devils number.
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Taemon



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wic wrote:
How is it taking more space than needed? Don't they move their legs when told to scoot over?

Why do I have to tell them that? It's public transport, you don't take up more than your space.

Onimaru wrote:
just if it's not crowded I don't think leaving ten centimeters between my knees when I sit is an act of Misandry.

Then again, we're not talking about ten centimeters.
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Sam the Eagle



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 2:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Strix Varia wrote:
Any chance that Tat simply has an easier time drawing a sitting man like that? I would point out that the devil girl has a total of five fingers on both hands combined. I highly doubt Tat is making a subtle comment about the number five being the devils number.


I was thinking this was more a samurai/daimio posture reference than an actual manspreading


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