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April 20: Pimpbot Construction 3
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Mr. Meddler



Joined: 13 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 7:14 pm    Post subject: April 20: Pimpbot Construction 3 Reply with quote



Men are usually this egotistical, hm?
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KALXAK



Joined: 25 Nov 2017
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Location: Rogue

PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 7:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yes, men are.
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0z79



Joined: 06 May 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 7:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Better to reign in Hell, than serve in Heaven."
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Draculaura



Joined: 19 Sep 2015
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hell or heaven, whatever. Whoever tries to crush me gets destroyed.
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Strix Varia



Joined: 07 Feb 2016
Posts: 210
Location: State of confusion

PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KALXAK wrote:
yes, men are.

I suspect it is more accurate to say that's how humans are. Parents protect and teach their children and then get annoyed when they start rebelling. Bosses pay employees half of what they make and then wonder why the employees are not as dedicated to the job as the bosses. Chefs make great food for customers and then watch them bury it in Ketchup.

Just because you THINK you are doing something good for someone else doesn't mean they want or appreciate that type of help. I don't care what your sex, gender, race, religion, or political beliefs are. If someone you think you did a good thing for sucker punches you in the gut, you WILL take it personally.
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Mr Zero



Joined: 20 Oct 2009
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't vilify men. The "men" in this case, (Melvin? Wally? Poindexter?) the devil researcher guy, didn't do anything wrong. He tried to create something useful, beautiful, and intelligent but satisfied. Instead of "why was I programmed to feel pain?", the fembots were supposed to be alright with standing around and looking go while doing so. So what's wrong with that?
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Chronometry



Joined: 02 Mar 2016
Posts: 729
Location: Middle of Nowhere, England

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr Zero wrote:
(Melvin? Wally? Poindexter?)


Milton.

Mr Zero wrote:
So what's wrong with that?


The problem here, I think, is that no-one considered that putting what appears to be advanced AI into what amounts to a bodypillow and expecting them to be alright with it might cause them to be a bit upset when they inevitably grow beyond their programming.

It's supreme arrogance to assume that a sapient being would feel alright with being enslaved.
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Kurt91



Joined: 27 Jun 2015
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thing is, "Grew beyond their programming" means they weren't intended to do that.

I'm reminded of an interview that I had read a while back, where some programmers were trying to make an AI for a shooter game. (I forget which one.) They just wanted a convincing computer opponent for players to play against.

To boil it down into layman's terms, they wanted the computer players to consider all of the possible things to do, and pick the best strategy based on what the human player was doing.

When it came down to testing, the developers did what you would expect and sat down to play the game. Keep in mind, this was a game that they made themselves, so obviously they would be really good at it. After a prolonged session, they realized that they couldn't find the computer players anymore. Nobody was shooting at them, and it was almost as though the developers were the only ones there.

The computer players had taken to hiding from the developers. The AI realized that no matter what approach they picked to make the computer players live as long as possible, the developers still won. Therefore, "live as long as possible" meant "stay away from the human players and hide where you hopefully won't be found".

The solution to this was to turn down the AI's self-preservation, so they would continue to throw themselves at the human players, regardless of how skilled the players were or how much of a lead the players had.

So, in the end, let me ask you this. What would your opinion be if Milton here decided on taking the same approach? If the existing fembots tend to "grow beyond their programming", what if he were to intentionally turn down their programming a bit to make them less likely to do that? (Er... Let me clarify. Future models are dumbed-down. I'm not saying to capture and alter the existing ones.) Would that be seen as okay, and it's a good alternative, or would you see that as the equivalent of taking advantage sexually of the mentally-challenged?

Obviously, the AI in the video game I was mentioning were not self-aware in the sense of "this thing is alive". Milton probably sees the fembots in the same way. The AI is acting in a way that it wasn't meant to. It doesn't mean "this thing is alive", he sees it as the same thing as the AI in that video game, only with real-world justifications for the bug. To continue the video game analogy, he wants to make a game where players aren't shooting a target tied to a stick, he wants a good AI that can interact with the players. (A fem-bot that interacts with the person instead of laying there as an inanimate doll) Instead, he overshoots and makes self-aware AI. What would you feel is a suitable middle-ground for him to aim for?
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Draculaura



Joined: 19 Sep 2015
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Location: at your mom's house

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 5:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

creating a slave race is morally fucked any which way, sorry not sorry, hth
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netsplit



Joined: 13 Jan 2008
Posts: 86

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 6:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

See the problem is Milton refuses to admit his own failings. Refuses to see the abuse they suffer, refuses to accept is guilt in killing those fembots a couple new years series ago, refuses to having accept freewill gives a being their own autonomy.

Quite frankly he's describing slavery, and trying to justify it as freewill being a burden. It's creepy as fuck.

The fembots have always been a metaphor for how many women are expected to live in certain circles, expected to put other's interests ahead of their own. Reminds me of this bullshit from the 50s: https://www.littlethings.com/1950s-good-housewife-guide/
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Taemon



Joined: 08 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 8:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wait, is this a toaster thread? I mean, we still get those?
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Leohan



Joined: 26 Mar 2007
Posts: 1845

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kurt91 wrote:
Thing is, "Grew beyond their programming" means they weren't intended to do that.

I'm reminded of an interview that I had read a while back, where some programmers were trying to make an AI for a shooter game. (I forget which one.) They just wanted a convincing computer opponent for players to play against.

To boil it down into layman's terms, they wanted the computer players to consider all of the possible things to do, and pick the best strategy based on what the human player was doing.

When it came down to testing, the developers did what you would expect and sat down to play the game. Keep in mind, this was a game that they made themselves, so obviously they would be really good at it. After a prolonged session, they realized that they couldn't find the computer players anymore. Nobody was shooting at them, and it was almost as though the developers were the only ones there.

The computer players had taken to hiding from the developers. The AI realized that no matter what approach they picked to make the computer players live as long as possible, the developers still won. Therefore, "live as long as possible" meant "stay away from the human players and hide where you hopefully won't be found".

The solution to this was to turn down the AI's self-preservation, so they would continue to throw themselves at the human players, regardless of how skilled the players were or how much of a lead the players had.

So, in the end, let me ask you this. What would your opinion be if Milton here decided on taking the same approach? If the existing fembots tend to "grow beyond their programming", what if he were to intentionally turn down their programming a bit to make them less likely to do that? (Er... Let me clarify. Future models are dumbed-down. I'm not saying to capture and alter the existing ones.) Would that be seen as okay, and it's a good alternative, or would you see that as the equivalent of taking advantage sexually of the mentally-challenged?

Obviously, the AI in the video game I was mentioning were not self-aware in the sense of "this thing is alive". Milton probably sees the fembots in the same way. The AI is acting in a way that it wasn't meant to. It doesn't mean "this thing is alive", he sees it as the same thing as the AI in that video game, only with real-world justifications for the bug. To continue the video game analogy, he wants to make a game where players aren't shooting a target tied to a stick, he wants a good AI that can interact with the players. (A fem-bot that interacts with the person instead of laying there as an inanimate doll) Instead, he overshoots and makes self-aware AI. What would you feel is a suitable middle-ground for him to aim for?

I think the difference lies in the complexity, you see.

The sort of AI you describe for the game is called machine learning. A computer experiments over and over in order to develop optimal strategies and solutions to given problems. Solutions that prove useful. Although it is quite an accomplishment to program something of the sort, it is but the most basic shape of AI.

Milton programmed the fembots to be HAPPY. To have an emotion. But can happiness be achieved if not in contrast to a whole array of other emotions? Perhaps that's the reason the reality zone has an emotional impact in the bots. It changes "I am happy" for "What am I happy about, exactly, and why?"

Milton is clearly confused about this. He's a devil person, he knows nothing about reality! He figures something is failing and seems to feel legitimately bad for his creations, so he'll continue to tweak and see if he can fix the problem. Make 'happy' into 'happier'. The underlying problem, though, is that happiness cannot exist in a void. That's not reality.
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Leohan



Joined: 26 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Taemon wrote:
Wait, is this a toaster thread? I mean, we still get those?


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KALXAK



Joined: 25 Nov 2017
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

anyways, men are that egotistical.
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Nobody Important



Joined: 18 Jan 2016
Posts: 767

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

netsplit wrote:
See the problem is Milton refuses to admit his own failings. Refuses to see the abuse they suffer, refuses to accept is guilt in killing those fembots a couple new years series ago, refuses to having accept freewill gives a being their own autonomy.

Quite frankly he's describing slavery, and trying to justify it as freewill being a burden. It's creepy as fuck.

The fembots have always been a metaphor for how many women are expected to live in certain circles, expected to put other's interests ahead of their own. Reminds me of this bullshit from the 50s: https://www.littlethings.com/1950s-good-housewife-guide/


Also he's a creep that made drones specifically so he could stare at more women's bodies.

KALXAK wrote:
anyways, men are that egotistical.


On average, yes definitely. At least a lot more than women. Society teaches them that not only do they have to be the best at everything (barring "girly" things), they also have to dominate everything. They're taught that their rightful place is always at the top. It's so deeply embedded in them that sometimes even good men who try their hardest not to be awful end up exhibiting this behavior at some point, intentionally or not. It's just sad really.
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