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May 25, 2018: Better Programming 25
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Bogy



Joined: 30 Sep 2014
Posts: 272
Location: United States

PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Samsally wrote:
Bogy wrote:
Samsally wrote:
... to say nothing of its gross roots in the idea that men "own" their daughters until they give them away.

Two problems with your assumptions. First, that anyone, including me, could think they owned my daughters, would be seriously mistaken, and they would inform them of that in short order. That's how they were raised.

Second, I didn't give either of my daughters away. Not how I do weddings. I ask all present, family and friends, to stand and take a vow to love and support those committing themselves to each other. But nobody gets "given away."

But, this is nothing new. Lots of assumptions get made about me, and what people think they know about me.


bogy, the roots of a sexist cultural practice are just that, roots. i wasn't saying you think you own anyone, and I'm profoundly uninterested in criticizing your daughters wedding practices, whatever they were.

you've managed to completely gloss over my actual point for indignation though, so that's great

Nice to know you weren't really directing your comment to me, when you responded to my post.
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Samsally



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 7584

PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

... okay. there's a fundamental misunderstanding here that I will try to outline.

the roots of a sexist cultural behavior are not the sexist cultural behavior. they are the history behind the thing, get it? roots? the past? people behaved one way for years and years and years and it directly affects how we behave today.

threatening a teen daughter's date with a shotgun is a behavior that is normalized because years ago men had direct control over their daughters to the extent of dictating who they could date, marry, and fuck.

threatening teenagers with shotguns is otherwise not normal at all. but in this ONE INSTANCE its socially acceptable. Which is...

wait for it.

pretty sexist.

you really want me to be accusing you personally of all kinds of shit when all i'm saying is the one thing. threatening daughter's boyfriends with shotguns is kinda sexist.

and you STILL haven't addressed my original point. which is that it doesn't work anyway.
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Samsally the GrayAce
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Nobody Important



Joined: 18 Jan 2016
Posts: 843

PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Samsally wrote:
... okay. there's a fundamental misunderstanding here that I will try to outline.

the roots of a sexist cultural behavior are not the sexist cultural behavior. they are the history behind the thing, get it? roots? the past? people behaved one way for years and years and years and it directly affects how we behave today.

threatening a teen daughter's date with a shotgun is a behavior that is normalized because years ago men had direct control over their daughters to the extent of dictating who they could date, marry, and fuck.


This is what I was trying to get at before. It's not that Bogy thinks he owns his daughter. It's about the relations between a men and their female relative's sex lives in general. The shotgun cliche, men asking the girls father for her hand in marriage, brothers being overprotective of their sisters, the "I fucked your mom" jokes that men and boys make ad nauseam. Stuff like that.
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Samsally



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 7584

PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

right, exactly, its all tied to the same ideas that are so ingrained they're super hard to even see, let alone address and change. i'm really not trying to be mean right now!
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Taemon



Joined: 08 Aug 2013
Posts: 2184
Location: Europe

PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bogy wrote:
Many participants here have gone out of their way to deliberately misunderstand me since my first posts on the site.

*shrug* Maybe it's you. To my eyes, Strix Varia was projecting their ass off when addressing your post. Could be they have the same frame of reference, no? Could be no one is "deliberately misunderstanding" - I'm just taking your words at face value.

(Saying "I raised my daughters to inform you I don't own them and I decide how their weddings go" isn't really helping matters.)
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